calling all EVH/Axis owners...

[ratter]

Ok, I've come to a realization recently (only took a decade or so ) and I'm looking for others' opinions before I decide if I'm on track or completely nutso.

I have two EVH's and an Axis. One of the EVH's outshines the other two by a wide margin, tone-wise. An interesting difference between all of them? The pickups in the "good" EVH are significantly lower (closer to the body) than on the other two guitars...by a good 1/16" and more. My feeling is that this is causing the difference in tone. Lower pickups = slightly lower output, more definition, less harsh, etc.

The "bad" EVH is currently in the shop getting the pickups lowered (cavities routed deeper) so that the measurements match the good one. Before any of you collector types hang me , it's not really an EVH. It's an oddball...an EVH without the signature (pre-Axis, post-EVH). Ok, so maybe that makes me even stupider. But I digress...

So, you guys and gals who have one or more of these guitars and a fine ruler, I'd be interested to know:

How close are your pickups to the strings (distance from the top of the bobbin to the bottom of the string, bass side and treble side? This assumes that your bridge height is set correctly. If you have more than one of these guitars and they measure differently, how do the tones differ?

Mike

 

[Jape]

hmm interesting. I think you might be onto something. I have noticed a difference. One has way more "shine" then the other. Which the guitars are known for being 'bright' anyhoo but I can see and actually hear your logic. I'd be interested in knowing what difference your "oddball" has after the operation. I did measure as well, a good 1/18.

 

[ratter]

I will post back in a week or so. The guitar that I sent to be fixed has waaayyy too harsh a tone, and I'm 99.9% sure it's the pickups.

 

[Jim Warnstedt]

The oddball guitar you have, is it the EVH non signature? I have an EVH non signature that is blue quilt with trem. What color/configuration is yours?

 

[ratter]

The oddball guitar you have, is it the EVH non signature? I have an EVH non signature that is blue quilt with trem. What color/configuration is yours?

Yup, exactly! It's red quilt, hardtail.

 

[Jape]

Mind telling Us how much the overhaul will cost?

 

[Jape]

Was it the pickups? Maybe the overhaul caused a problem? I'm curious if it was worth the time and money to make the adjustments or not.

Jape

 

[ratter]

Nothing to report yet...the tech is very backlogged, so the guitar hasn't been worked on yet. I promise I'll report back with full details!

 

[ratter]

Ok, got the guitar back - immediately noticed the difference upon plugging in. The tone is more open, "stringier", overall just more toneful. With the pickups so close to the strings before, there was no sublety. The tone was just harsh and compressed-sounding. This is a definite improvement, and the "bad" EVH now hangs with the "good" EVH. I don't want to recommend anybody hacking into their collectible guitars, but especially for Axis/Sport/Super Sport owners, I would highly, highly, highly recommend at least investigating this phenomenon.

 

[Jape]

So the overhaul was worth it, very cool. It's something to consider it seems. (i think it was the "highly, highly, highly" part that convinced me. not to mention the " phenomenon" heh) I'm just wondering if you think it would have been easier to just purchase a different guitar for a different tonal sound? I like the fact that you at least went for it.

Japes

 

[ex3.8]

Sometimes........

It's easyer and cheaper to seek mariage councilling that divorcing ha ha ha

 

[ratter]

So the overhaul was worth it, very cool. It's something to consider it seems. (i think it was the "highly, highly, highly" part that convinced me. not to mention the " phenomenon" heh) I'm just wondering if you think it would have been easier to just purchase a different guitar for a different tonal sound? I like the fact that you at least went for it.

Japes

Different guitar? No way! The goal isn't a different EVH tone, the goal is the *ideal* EVH tone!

Let me put it like this. I own three EVH/Axissesses , and have played countless others in stores, belonging to friends, etc. Due to 1) the amount of hand-finishing that goes into each guitar (one of the reasons we love them), 2) the way the basswood is soft and can compress when pickups are installed, and 3) the lack of adjustability after the fact, I would be surprised if any two of these guitars had exactly the same pickup height relative to the strings. This is my theory, at least. I know that my three guitars were all different.

And *in my opinion*, especially with hot pickups like these, getting them too close to the strings *ruins* the tone. But if you have no frame of reference to compare, you might never find that out! So it's not that I want a different tone out of the EVH/Axis...it is what it is...what I want is for that tone to be optimized. My fear would be that people who have only ever played/owned an EVH/Axis where the pickups are too close to the strings would be missing out on the tonal capabilities that these guitars have. And that would be a damn shame for something so easy to fix!

I think that one of my guitars lucked into having things in the "sweet spot". I had the pickup routes deepened in the 2nd guitar to exactly match the first. I probably won't keep the 3rd guitar forever, simply because I don't need 3...but if I were going to keep it, I absolutely would have the same work done to it.

Also, I wouldn't really call it an overhaul...it's actually a pretty simple procedure. But it helps to have a good, thorough tech who will think things through completely (such as the basswood squishing) so that the job gets done right. The guitar also needs to be setup before the work is done, since ultimately the pickup height is relative to the string location, so you want that settled first.

If anybody at the EB/MM factory is listening - I wonder if this spec could be checked on guitars leaving the factory to get an idea of how consistent (or in-) the guitars are in this respect?

 

[Jimi D]

Ratter, I really have to thank you for this post... I'd noticed that I had a pretty harsh neck pup in one of my Axisesses for a while now, but I was avoiding the issue and and using the bridge pickup almost exclusively on that guitar, with the idea that "eventually" I'd change the pickup or something... Anyway, your thread got me thinking, and after being frustrated with the neck pup tone yet again playing out Friday night, I decided to pull the pickup and see what was up... Low and behold, I discovered that the guy that owned the guitar before me had installed a couple small springs under the pickup, effectively raising it about 1/16" or a little more even when the screws were fully torqued down... I pulled the springs, reinstalled the pup, and everything came out right - I've got my neck pup back! Thanks

 

[ratter]

Awesome.

 

[Jape]

Thanks for breaking it down and I'm glad you're so giddy about it

Japes

 

[akozols]

HI,

I had a pink EVH that I wish I never sold. I now have a Wolfgang FLametop Special that I modded to have more of the broken in feel of the EVH. I lowered the fret height as sanded the edge of the fingerboard for a more worn in feel. I replaced the stock pickups with a set of Tone Zone and Paf Pro. The big thing I did was to route out the pickup cavities and install cream pickup rings. I have the TZ set almost 1/4" from the strings and it changes the TZ from a compressed sound to the open/glassy sound of the EVH.

I've talked to Steve B from Dimarzio and he swears the Axis/EVH is very very very clsoe the the TZ, it's all in the height. He also recomends the Air Zone for those who can't adjust the height but want that sound.


PS, I also sold a Silhouette Special and kick myself everyday for doing so


Al

 

[Jimi D]

PS, I also sold a Silhouette Special and kick myself everyday for doing so

What a coincidence! My first EB/MM was a Luke II that I bought at the Guitar Center Lansdowne, PA - I ended up trading it for a Jem7VWH, and frequently kick myself for doing that, too!!

 

[VOLTAGE]

HI,
I've talked to Steve B from Dimarzio and he swears the Axis/EVH is very very very clsoe the the TZ, it's all in the height.

Al

Not only the height of the pup,but keep in mind the tone zone is a "dual resonance " design pup,which means the coils are UNBALANCED,the custom wound dimarzio EVH in the axis has matched coils.
if you take a reading on the TONE ZONE one coil (bridge side) is 8+K and the neck coil is 9+K.
the EVH custom wound has two 8.6K coils.
the neck pup on the EVH and axis is just about exact to a air norton though,the only difference with these is VH's is a touch hotter in output. he is 14K and the air norton is 12.K but non the less they are VERY,VERY close.
the tone zone is dimarzio's "closest" sounding pup to the EVH custom wound but it still is not the same
I have a set of these custom dimarzio's and i can honestly say that they are truley amazing pups,the bridge one is hot but crisp and clean and is VERY VANHALEN like when you want it to be and can do many other styles as well,a very versitle set IMHO

 

[VOLTAGE]

Ok, I've come to a realization recently (only took a decade or so ) and I'm looking for others' opinions before I decide if I'm on track or completely nutso.

I have two EVH's and an Axis. One of the EVH's outshines the other two by a wide margin, tone-wise. An interesting difference between all of them? The pickups in the "good" EVH are significantly lower (closer to the body) than on the other two guitars...by a good 1/16" and more. My feeling is that this is causing the difference in tone. Lower pickups = slightly lower output, more definition, less harsh, etc.

The "bad" EVH is currently in the shop getting the pickups lowered (cavities routed deeper) so that the measurements match the good one. Before any of you collector types hang me , it's not really an EVH. It's an oddball...an EVH without the signature (pre-Axis, post-EVH). Ok, so maybe that makes me even stupider. But I digress...

So, you guys and gals who have one or more of these guitars and a fine ruler, I'd be interested to know:

How close are your pickups to the strings (distance from the top of the bobbin to the bottom of the string, bass side and treble side? This assumes that your bridge height is set correctly. If you have more than one of these guitars and they measure differently, how do the tones differ?

Mike

RATTER, the height for ED's pickups in his EBMM's was 4/32nds high E and 5/32nds low E. this is measuring from the top of the slug poles to the bottom of the strings.
his neck pup was 7/32nds low E and 6/32" high E with the same measuring technique.
VH does not like the pups magnet pull to interfere with the strings vibration,plus l when a pup is set lower like this it really opens up the voice of the pup,especially the higher output ones like the VH custom wound dimarzio's

 

[ratter]

Re: Re: calling all EVH/Axis owners...

RATTER, the height for ED's pickups in his EBMM's was 4/32nds high E and 5/32nds low E. this is measuring from the top of the slug poles to the bottom of the strings.
his neck pup was 7/32nds low E and 6/32" high E with the same measuring technique.
VH does not like the pups magnet pull to interfere with the strings vibration,plus l when a pup is set lower like this it really opens up the voice of the pup,especially the higher output ones like the VH custom wound dimarzio's

Thanks for the info! I need to find a ruler and find out what my exact measurements ended up being - but I definitely agree with your description of the tonal result.