Off Topic 212 cab too much/loud for home use?

[luv]

Hey all,

I'm considering picking up an open back 212 to pair up with my Blackheart Handsome Devil head (15w/7w). I'm currently running the head with the matching 112 closed back cab and I'm not happy with the sound....too boxy. I don't need the projection of a closed back cab and I'd prefer to have a bigger/broader sound, but not necessarily louder.

I live in a big house, so noise levels can be above bedroom and living room levels at times. I don't ,however, want to have ear fatigue from too much volume all the time. I play in a 12 x 30 man cave and usually I'm within 10-12 feet of my cabinet.

Is anyone using a 212 cab for home use? Too loud? Tolerable? What do you think?

 

[RobertJFortner]

SURE!

However,
I used to play a 5150II through a Marshall 4x12 in my old house. I think my answer might be skewed (haha)

 

[fbecir]

At home, I use mainly a 2x12" cab with a small tube head. I can play during the day with a good volume, but also the night when wife & kids are sleeping. Of course I have to change a bit the master volume of the amp ...

 

[littlephil]

The amp matters more in terms of volume than the cab does. Even so, every amp has a volume knob!

I've had my Mark IV 1x12 combo unbearably loud, and when I had it, my old Marshall TSL100 + 4x12 cab at whisper volumes.
As long as you set the volume at a sensible level, any amp/cab combo can be used at home without being too loud.

 

[ScoobySteve]

The amp pushing the cab is more important IMO. It appears that you have a 15w switchable to 7w amp head. Shouldn't be too bad. And the quality of the cabinet is also important.

If it comes down to a decent 2x12 vs. a high quality 1x12 ill take the latter all day. I have played through many 1x12 that can project and fill a small club perfectly fine, no less a man cave.

Two Rock makes a wonderful semi open 1x12 that gives you the best of both worlds. It can project well but also gives great low end response and it fills the room great. Hands down the best 1x12 I have ever played through. (Might have been the TR amp clouding my judgement though)

Dr. Z also has a 1x12 that has a removable back plate for open or closed function. Their standard 2x12 ( not the Z Best) is another high quality open back 2x12 if you decide to go that route.

Good luck man. Be sure to let us know what you decide on.

 

[JMD]

You might try taking off the back of your 112 as an experiment to see (or rather - hear) if the sound is closer to what you want....that may give you an indication regarding the 212 open back option.

Is there the option of runing both cabs? I find a slightly boxy sound helps cut through the rest of the band......sort of 'sounds ok on its own, but sounds great in the mix' thing.

 

[peterd79]

after i got rid of my Orange AD30HTC and Closed back 212 (which i used at home and would dang near rip the roof off) i went to 112 combo amps and then add in an extra 112 cabinet.

I like the combo way a bit better because my combo is open back and then i run my extension cab closed. the Boxiness really does help push it in the cut. my amp is a dr z maz 18 jr and will run it with 2x12s all day long in my house at volumes loud enough to really get that breakup and saturation of the tubes that i want without willing myself or my neighbors.
with the 15w/7w options you'll be perfectly fine with 212s...

 

[beej]

No doubt that different cabs/speakers will give your amp a different flavour. I like OB or ported cabs for that reason, better dispersion, more highs.

But before you spend any money, make sure you actually like the sound of your amp. Usually when I hear people say their amp sounds "boxy", it's not something a cab/speaker swap can fix. Any way to try it out on other cabinets? Buddy's place, store, etc?

 

[ScreaminFloyd]

Me = 4x12 1960A Marshall & 4x12 Vintage TV Marshall & AC30 2x12 . Really the only way to play is to move to a Farm & Dime the Amp's

 

[aleclee]

As long as you set the volume at a sensible level, any amp/cab combo can be used at home without being too loud.

But that doesn't mean it'll sound particularly good.

 

[Roubster]

I bought a used mesa 3/4 back 1x12 which sounds huge at low volumes and loud enough for smaller venue live gigs. But I do agree that the amp is the most important. You can always get an attenuator if the amp is a beast. That's my plan eventually to upgrade from my blackstar to a Mesa or Suhr.

 

[brokenvail]

I agree with the guys, it is subjective. I have used 2x12 and 4x12 at home. The head is the key

 

[spkirby]

I've been through a load of high end amps and cabs in my years of tone chasing.

I use a 2x12 for home use and after lots of combinations I have settled on a THD 2-12 in paisley tolex (Click Here : THD Electronics). Simply put, this cab makes any amp sound better... and I've put Fender, Dr Z, Bogner, Blackstar and Cornford heads through it all with excellent results.

 

[Jimmyb]

I think I may be the voice of dissent here.

The speakers are more important, as it's the displacement of air that actually makes the noise you hear. The more air that you move, the louder it gets.

 

[ScreaminFloyd]

His problem is a boxy sound. Really you need a good Reverb pedal to open up your tone. I only use Reverb in Small enclosed rooms. Outside or a Bigger room, The Reverb is out the window. Also you have to be patient and dial in your Amp. If it was easy everyone would be doing it eh? I've been through many Amps as well. Looking back as my playing changed, Then so did my Amp and sound. If you really pay attention when playing in your house, Your Tone will be different from playing during the daytime Vs. Night time. I have no clue why, It just is. Usually Louder during the day and Volume lower at night. I find at home the best tones are at Night time. Best sound over all again is Dimed and using the guitars volume knob outside.

 

[littlephil]

But that doesn't mean it'll sound particularly good.

Thats not the amps fault, no amp sounds particularly good at very low volumes. Highs are dull, bass is weak, it happens with every amp because of the differing frequency contours we perceive at varying volumes.

 

[ScoobySteve]

What a conundrum. New cabby is big bucks, I would try as many cabinets as possible before committing. But therein is the difficult part. As many have said you have to be sure that you're happy with your amp. "Boxiness" as some have mentioned is not something that we can really cure by just swapping a cab.

A closed back cabby should sound "directional" and "zonal" and have a tone "sweet spot" as they say. Now that I think about it, "boxiness" really shouldn't be the word at all. It might just be the room. Only your ears can decide. When people say boxy, I think of a tone that is quite compressed and lifeless gain.

Be sure to experiment with different cab types and speakers too. A buddy of mine used v30's his whole life assuming they were just an industry standard (well, which they are to a certain degree I guess) then tried a couple of 25w green backs and jensens and was totally blown away by the difference.

I feel your pain Luv. Finding a right amp,cab, speaker combination that suits your tone isn't easy at all, so good luck man.

 

[Spudmurphy]

I don't know if this helps at all - just a comparison of speakers really.

 

[luv]

Thanks for the responses. I've found an Avatar open back 212 in near new shape (locally) that the guy will sell to me for $300. It has a Vintage 30 and a G12H30 (celestion) in it. Avatar also sells a closed back conversion kit for it for $15.....not that I couldn't make one myself, but for $15 it is pre cut and predrilled for existing screws and I wouldn't have to mess with it. So I could easily convert back and forth between open and closed back to compare sound.

Obviously, sound is subjective. I've always prefered 12" speakers over anything else, and I've never played through anything more than a single 12". My thought process was/is that two is better than one.....right? I'm wanting more of a "round....open vowel....and fuller" sound than I'm currently hearing. My logic tells me that a 212 open back will get me closer to that sound than where I am now. I run effects, so I do use reverb to open up the 112, but I'm thinking that a 212 open back with some reverb might sound HUGE without having to be real loud. Who knows, it's all part of the tinkering process. For me, half the fun is in trying new stuff.

I've also ordered some new tubes for my head to play around with. I do like my head, but I will be looking into the Mesa Transatlantic ta-15 down the road....seems like a cool amp.

 

[fbecir]

The advantage of having several speakers is the sound projection. For the same volume, the sound will be distributed more evenly in the room.
For playing live, I use a 4x10" configuration : a good compromise between sound projection and weight ...