Help! Before the Lynching

[jt733]

Guys- Before you find out where i live and come to my home and string me up- I'm sorry for ranting- I am very, very frustrated with this guitar, and I should just sell it, but here's the story- My wife bought this guitar for me as a special present, and it's killing her as much as it's killing me that I'm not happy with it. I've been an obsessed fan of Dream Theater's since I lived in NY circa 1990. I bought this guitar in June ( maybe May 31) and I didn't really get to play it for a few weeks, and then with only a few days off a week, it was a few months before I noticed this problem. My call back to Drumcity was immediate, and their support was awesome, but they said to send the guitar to EB. Dan McPherson, and AJ have spent most of their days this summer answering emails, and phone calls from me- They have been awesome too!! I sent the guitar to them in August, and they could not hear what I was hearing. They sent it back, and I played the guitar to them over the phone, and the reply was " I guess I did hear that, but it sounded differently on our amp" I've searched online for a remedy, and thought about selling the guitar. More calls and emails to EB, Dream theater, John Petrucci, and Drumcity, and here we are in October, and the problem still exists. So I went to the ernieball forum, and posted a rant- a rant which I'm sorry upset everyone, but I'm getting desperate. This is the best guitar in the world- the best guitarist in the world plays this one- therefore it HAS to be the BEST. Right??

So to Ernie Ball- I'm sorry, to all that have posted- I'm sorry- I'm sure someone has an idea to try that may help this resonance out.

 

[beej]

Ok, understood.

So the problem is physical, not electrical. You can hear a "resonance" when you play, without being plugged in?

Off-hand, it sounds like a setup issue. I'd take a stab at turning the truss rod, cranking up the action a bit, and making sure it's not just hitting a fret. (Due to humidity, it would be different at your location than it would when shipped out to MM in SLO.)

It's not binding in the nut (Playing at the first fret would eliminate that)? What about the saddles? Anything vibrating back there? What if you touch them one at a time?

In short, if something is vibrating oddly, can you stick your ear to various parts of the body/neck and identify what it is? Has to be something.

 

[tommyindelaware]

mabey it's not the guitar ????????
have you played another (same model ) guitar thru your rig to compare ?

 

[Grand Wazoo]

On my little quest to make Santa real again, I discovered that some of the people are having trouble with their strings touching the neck after the nut- SURE ENOUGH, my Low B string a Slinky set of 9's- was touching to the point of scratching the finish on the other side- I removed it, and the guitar sounds much better- still not worth $3000... but maybe we're onto something Orville... Stay tuned

Hi there JT733,

without sounding offensive to you, and I apologize in advance if any of my words here will sound like it, but... I am getting the impression that you are trying in your own mind to justify the $3000 you have spent on this guitar.

Surely you are not nuts, even if you say that the people at the Guitar Centre think you are cookoo, you are not!

Yet, when more than 10 people tells you that your guitar doesn't have a real problem, then... if I was you, I would begin to think that perhaps it is all in my head and perhaps you would have been happier with a mexican Strat or even a jap Ibanez 7 strings if 7 stringers are your thing.

Now let's be constructive, you need to break this down into different condition tests.

First of all where are you experiencing these issues, and I mean where in the house do you play your guitar. Is it your bedroom? your study, a music studio? the garage? which?

Try a) positioning your amp in another corner or location of the house, it is possible that different woods vibrate differently to other instruments, this can cause a resonant dissonance depending on the object or sound obstructions around your playing environment when the sound emitted by your instrumnt bounces off and hits you back with a bad vibe.

Have you tried playing it anywhere else than your usual spot?

then.... try b) play your guitar totally clean through a headphone amp or a console that allows you to listen to it not from a speaker but from a set of hd/phones and see if you get the same problem.

and

Finally c) perform the same tests with any other guitar and compare the results.

Worst case scenario, if all the same problem still persist only with your MM, you have one last test to accertain that indeed your axe is "naff" (London slang for dodgy or f'd up), so you need to compare this with another guitar exact same model as yours.

Then and only then you will be able to prove that if the exact same guitar plays perfectly without this problem, then your guitar is well and truly naff and you should seek about a replacement from these very nice and understanding people at EBMM. And you can then tell yourself you are not nuts.

But if the exact same guitar still does the same then you are playing the wrong guitar for YOU and you should go and try something else, hopefully another EBMM of course.

Good luck and let me know if any of the above tests brings you closer to a result.

How do I know all this?

I once had an almost similar problem with an expensive Mesa Boogie amp head/cab that would sound like crap in the usual room where I used to practice and I never had that same problem with a Gallien Krueger or a Trace Elliot, it was just that amp. I was almost on the verge of setting fire to the damn thing until someone suggested that I should try different positions (the gf was amused too ) low and behold, I've found out that a newly erected brick wall, (with new bricks compared to the old victorian ones on the opposite walls) was causing the sound to bounce back to the pickups (feedback?) and giving me all kinds of nasty response. I placed the amp against a different wall and the problem was gone.

 

[Big Poppa]

JT no problem


WE want to make it right. Keep in mind the guitar is pretty simple. If it makes the noise acoustically then it is our problem to suss out. If it doesnt you have somethin g in the signal chain that is not compatible. This is not BS or dodging an issue....just the straight story.

If it doesnt do it acoustically the start with your amp and a cable......if its there we have an issue with theamp and the guitar If not then we know that we have eliminated the guitar and amp....then one by one add your rig to the signal chain and when the bad sound appears there is where the incompatibility lies.

Posting a rant for your first post is like coming to a strangers house and passing gas.....DOnt worry apology accepted and I lit a match foryou.....
\

 

[TonyEVH5150]

It could be an issue with the new rig you set up. a crossed wire, faulty ground, maybe a problem with your bugera.

It could even be an issue of the wiring in that particular part of your house.

I'd even try eliminating parts of your signal chain until it's down to your guitar and amp. Even try another amp to see if the Bugera's the issue.

 

[Shadowbox]

Where is the resonance coming from? Can you describe it? Odd reverberations can occur all over the place. Do you hear it from the bridge? From the fretboard? Does it occur only when the guitar is amplified, or can you hear it when the guitar is not plugged in? Are you 100% familiar with the functionality of the piezo?

If you are having trouble isolating it, I would recommend taking your guitar AND amp to a luthier that you trust. From what you wrote earlier, I get the impression that the fine folks at EBMM (the best customer service in the business) could not get the guitar to fail.

Most of the folks on this forum would be happy to help you, but they're right to reprimand you for a non-specific bashing and freak-out! Even though you've probably explained it a zillion times, please be as specific as you can!

 

[Beth]

Hi John,

Having read all of the previous thread and having seen your level of anger, and then for you to say that you work in New York, I was gonna ask you... are you trading stocks? LOL

I am sure we'll resolve the issue somehow for you, hang in there!

-Beth

 

[jt733]

Sugar over Vinegar

There really is something to that- Thank you for so much help Again I'm really sorry for the rant.'

O.K.- here's the problem- When I play the guitar, the entire guitar wants to resonate- it almost feels like a hollow body- I can feel the neck vibrating through my left hand while I play, and if I rest a cord from a headset against the back of the neck- I can hear everything I play thru the cord ( not electronically ) I obviously hear it the most when the guitar starts to resonate ( no palm mute ) and those awesome pickups, do their job, send it to the 1101, and the signal gets processed. On the clean channel, on a bypass form the pedal board, [direct so to speak] I'm hearing multiple notes per note struck. Not fret buzz, not technique, just resonation. I don't seem to have the problem on the Ibanez ( locking nut !!!) for the exact settings, and set up- the big difference is the noise gate- the Ibanez plays at 30-35, and the BFR needs 80-85 to kill the non-muted strings. I can't play the guitar palm muted all the time!!

If I play an F- 2nd string 6th fret, and then play an F# ( same string ) , I hear 6 pitches, the open G,D,A, E and B, and of course the F#- If I play the F# with my middle finger, and place the index as a left handed "palm mute" the note is pure and clear. All notes are if I "kill" all the other strings other than the one I'm playing. If I don't- the whole guitar starts to resonate, and the problem compounds itself.

Picture an oscilloscope- one pitch would have 1 sine wave- when I play this guitar it looks like a kid without his ridalin playing on his etcha-sketch. Open strings would resonate, and the original pitch would sound like a 1/4 tone.

I've tried a hair band around the nut behind the nut, and that helped. I've had my wife hold the first fret while I was playing and that worked great- I have noticed, and after extensive research online- My Low B string is touching the fretboard behind the nut (it's actually scratched the finish there ) Maybe there is something to that- I've removed the string all together, and without re trimming ( something I'd have to do if I were serious, I know ) the problem was cut by more than half....I have a piece of 3/4" foam in between the GIANT toneblock, and the end of the springs (where they meet) and that helped as well. But we're still not there yet. I've found similar issues with other EBMM BFR at Drumcity, but they said that it was due to the ceiling fans, and flourescent lights ( as it turns out- I have both, but no longer use them while I'm playing )

Thank you again for all your help- I will keep you posted as this week goes on.

 

[Big Poppa]

the string behind the nut is not your issue. this is why i hate customer service by forums especially the other ones. WOuld you have a vital organ diagnosed buy strangers on the internet?

Have you tried the trem springs? They will resonate and sometimes a little patch of foam or shrinnkwrapping each spring works great...

keep in mind that you are talking about four pieces of wood two pots one switch a trem along with springs two pickups and some wire....

 

[Jimmyb]

and a partridge in a pear tree.

 

[glockaxis]

Is it Christmas yet? LOL. I've actually seen Christmas lights out already!


Try BPs suggestion w/ the springs then get back to us.

 

[jt733]

It could be an issue with the new rig you set up. a crossed wire, faulty ground, maybe a problem with your bugera.

It could even be an issue of the wiring in that particular part of your house.

I'd even try eliminating parts of your signal chain until it's down to your guitar and amp. Even try another amp to see if the Bugera's the issue.

all the other guitars perform flawlessly. I'm not sure what else I can do. It happens when the guitar is plugged into the amp directly on the clean channel- None of the other 3 guitars seem to have this problem- but this is my first non locking neck.

 

[jt733]

the string behind the nut is not your issue. this is why i hate customer service by forums especially the other ones. WOuld you have a vital organ diagnosed buy strangers on the internet?

Have you tried the trem springs? They will resonate and sometimes a little patch of foam or shrinnkwrapping each spring works great...

keep in mind that you are talking about four pieces of wood two pots one switch a trem along with springs two pickups and some wire....

I have a piece of 3/4" foam inbetween where the springs meet that GIANT trem block. It helped, but still no brass ring.

 

[jt733]

Where is the resonance coming from? Can you describe it? Odd reverberations can occur all over the place. Do you hear it from the bridge? From the fretboard? Does it occur only when the guitar is amplified, or can you hear it when the guitar is not plugged in? Are you 100% familiar with the functionality of the piezo?

If you are having trouble isolating it, I would recommend taking your guitar AND amp to a luthier that you trust. From what you wrote earlier, I get the impression that the fine folks at EBMM (the best customer service in the business) could not get the guitar to fail.

Most of the folks on this forum would be happy to help you, but they're right to reprimand you for a non-specific bashing and freak-out! Even though you've probably explained it a zillion times, please be as specific as you can!

It happens when the guitar is plugged in, or acoustic ( worse when on a dirty channel [ especially on a delay patch]) When I play an F I get a pure clean tone, when I slide up a 1/2 step, and play an F# it sounds like 6 different pitches- and all the other strings start to resonate. If i;m on the tuner the F holds my "digital strobe" steady- when I play an F# the dots at the bottom of the tuner jump wildly. It {the F#}sounds like 1/4 tones

 

[Big Poppa]

I dont think this guitar is for you. we talked to Drum City and they said that none of the guitars in stock met your expectations. We sometimes arent a good fit.

 

[Big Poppa]

the scale length is correct I repeat that we probably cannot meet your expectations.

 

[jt733]

Ok, understood.

So the problem is physical, not electrical. You can hear a "resonance" when you play, without being plugged in?

Off-hand, it sounds like a setup issue. I'd take a stab at turning the truss rod, cranking up the action a bit, and making sure it's not just hitting a fret. (Due to humidity, it would be different at your location than it would when shipped out to MM in SLO.)

It's not binding in the nut (Playing at the first fret would eliminate that)? What about the saddles? Anything vibrating back there? What if you touch them one at a time?

In short, if something is vibrating oddly, can you stick your ear to various parts of the body/neck and identify what it is? Has to be something.

It's been set up several times for me at DrumCity, and the truss rod has been adjusted accordingly- Denver and SLO are probably close in humidity, and the guitars - all of them- are kept in a climate controlled room. This isn;t fret noise- it's string noise. The guitar is so well built that when a note is played, anything sympathetic to that note starts to sing.

 

[jt733]

I dont think this guitar is for you. we talked to Drum City and they said that none of the guitars in stock met your expectations. We sometimes arent a good fit.

All of those guitars had the exact same problem, but I was told that it was because of the fluorescent lights and ceiling fans- I stopped using them in my play room, and it made a big difference- I was also told that it was a problem of the B string- The diameter, and tension is always a problem on guitars- That's where i'm having the worst time with it. If I play in the 7th position, non palm muted, and stop playing without touching the rest of the guitar with either hand, the guitar (open strings sympathetic to the notes I've played) sings forever. AJ says that it's just the lack of locking neck. My Ibanez's have the floyd. and my Steinberger travel has the double ball end strings. ( My 3 control group guitars for this project) You guys make the best guitar in the world ofr the best guitarist in the world. Is there a chance that I'm not crazy? Even if I wanted to find another guitar that might be a better fit, 1 I wouldn't know where to go, and 2 it would be a huge step down in quality !! I'm so lost!

 

[jt733]

Hi John,

Having read all of the previous thread and having seen your level of anger, and then for you to say that you work in New York, I was gonna ask you... are you trading stocks? LOL

I am sure we'll resolve the issue somehow for you, hang in there!

-Beth

Everyone is working really hard for me! I totally appreciate it, but we haven;'t fixed it just yet....