E string help

[element]

Hey guys, just a bit of advice needed. It seems that when I play the last fret on my stingray (22nd?, too lazy to count ) on the E string, the note seems kind of lifeless and dead. The intonation is fine because i've recently adjusted it, and all of the other strings also seem fine. Could it be caused by a dead string? or are there any other possible causes?

EDIT: it seems like it happens on a few frets below the 22nd too, the 19th upwards sound a little dodgy.

 

[sandaas]

Well, I've always thought that the thickest strings, typically E & B, sounds - I won't say bad, but"kind of lifeless and dead" as you put it - on the highest frets.

Think that's normal when the strings reach a certain thickness..
I don't know.. Just my two cents..

cheers!

 

[Psycho Ward]

If the notes sound and don't buzz I don't think you have any fret problems.

I haven't got past the fifth fret chapter in my Mel Bay "You Too Can Look Cool and Play The Bass" book though...

 

[element]

Well I recently set my bass up, and because I hadnt used it for so long (how could I!? ) I forgot what it sounded like. I thought i'd made an error or something that I couldn't figure out, but I tried my cousins stingray and they sound identical, so it must be to do with the string thickness. Thanks for the help guys, good luck with the book psycho

 

[Urwordsbreakmed]

Play it on a different string? hahaha I damn sure dont use those frets.... but generally your lowers string have rounded very soft and indistinct tone compare to the same note at the same pitch on a higher string. So you best bet if verything else sounds fine is just to move where your playing the song.

 

[AnthonyD]

E string?

22nd fret?

For real?

 

[Golem]

E string?

22nd fret?

For real?

Just picture it: It's about 9 inches from 22nd fret to saddle. Let's call it 10 inches.

A typical E-string is 0.105 inch, call it .10 inch, or 1/10 inch.

It takes 100 'tenths' to make 'ten' of anything, including 'inches'.

So, the piece of "string" involved is only 100X longer than its diameter. And it's made of steel? That's not a "string". It's a steel rod. Of course it won't play if you just poke it with your finger. You gotta hit it with a mallet. Actually, if you eliminate all that rounding off, this steel dowel we're trying to pluck is not even 90X longer than its own diameter. Thunk-thunk.

 

[AnthonyD]

LOL! Exactly what I was thinking (but didn't know how to say!)

 

[element]

Ok ok, just wanted to check, dont think theres anything wrong with that is there? I'd never done a setup before and wanted to see if it was normal or something i'd done wrong in the setup process.

 

[AnthonyD]

No worries - just having a bit of a giggle!

I just checked my Sterling and there is no issue with my playing any of the strings in the 20 - 21 - 22 fret range. They ring clear.

Perhaps there is a tweak you need to make in your set-up, but I couldn't say what - difficult to diagnose within the context of the forum.

 

[jongitarz]

Just picture it: It's about 9 inches from 22nd fret to saddle. Let's call it 10 inches.

A typical E-string is 0.105 inch, call it .10 inch, or 1/10 inch.

It takes 100 'tenths' to make 'ten' of anything, including 'inches'.

So, the piece of "string" involved is only 100X longer than its diameter. And it's made of steel? That's not a "string". It's a steel rod. Of course it won't play if you just poke it with your finger. You gotta hit it with a mallet. Actually, if you eliminate all that rounding off, this steel dowel we're trying to pluck is not even 90X longer than its own diameter. Thunk-thunk.

 

[element]

No worries - just having a bit of a giggle!

Its fine, if thats what you like to do when people have serious questions to ask. I use this place to try and gain experience by asking about things that I dont understand/or would like to know more about. I like to have a "giggle" too, but only when its appropriate. They say people are stupid for not asking questions about things they dont understand, but now I feel stupid for asking the question. Sorry if you think im being a bit of a bitch about it or whatever, but its just something I personally wouldn't do. Still, we're all different.

 

[barkatozz]

No worries - just having a bit of a giggle!

I just checked my Sterling and there is no issue with my playing any of the strings in the 20 - 21 - 22 fret range. They ring clear.

Perhaps there is a tweak you need to make in your set-up, but I couldn't say what - difficult to diagnose within the context of the forum.

Same here.....no probs hitting the upper frets on the 'E' string.
BTW.....Stingrays have 21 frets.

 

[bovinehost]

They say people are stupid for not asking questions about things they dont understand, but now I feel stupid for asking the question.

Don't. Listen, I'm not exactly a newcomer to this instrument (you wouldn't know it from listening to me play, but that's another issue), but nearly every day, I learn something here.

Sure, they were having a bit of a laugh at your expense, but I'd never considered the reality of the E string up around that fret. So - I learned something today in spite of myself.

Let it roll off and ask yourself if you'll forget the concept. You'll be healthier, too.

Okay?

Jack

 

[JB1]

Back OT Element, how old are the strings?

FWIW - I think you could probably expect a less punchy note way down there.

As a temp solution, could you play the high E elsewhere?

BTW, I've been known to venture to those desolate parts myself, don't worry about these fellas pulling your chain, it's all in good fun and there are some serious answers.

Only a smart arse never asks questions....

 

[teonigil]

Hey guys, just a bit of advice needed. It seems that when I play the last fret on my stingray (22nd?, too lazy to count ) on the E string, the note seems kind of lifeless and dead. The intonation is fine because i've recently adjusted it, and all of the other strings also seem fine. Could it be caused by a dead string? or are there any other possible causes?

EDIT: it seems like it happens on a few frets below the 22nd too, the 19th upwards sound a little dodgy.

Back to the original Q.

The problem is that the pickup magnets pull your string down, not allowing it to vibrate freely. It happens on higher fret positions since the higher you go the closer the string gets to the pickup magnets and it will affect the heavier strings since there's more metal in them to be pulled down.

Possible solutions:
1. Lower the pickup
2. Adjust the truss rod so that the neck is totally straight and lower the action (recommended)

In the second option you will reduce the ratio of string-pickup distance to fret location. Also, you might need to lower the pickup to manufacrurer's specs after lowering the action.

Bottom line: use option 1 if you like medium-high action and option 2 if you prefer it low.

Let us know how it went OK?

 

[tommyindelaware]

Hey guys, just a bit of advice needed. It seems that when I play the last fret on my stingray (22nd?, too lazy to count ) on the E string, the note seems kind of lifeless and dead. The intonation is fine because i've recently adjusted it, and all of the other strings also seem fine. Could it be caused by a dead string? or are there any other possible causes?

EDIT: it seems like it happens on a few frets below the 22nd too, the 19th upwards sound a little dodgy.

try lowering you pickup.......the magnetic field is too strong to allow the note to sustain naturally if the pickup is to close...........
experiment w/ the height to get to understand the relationship between the string , & the pickup.
same w/ the forum members....ya gotta experiment w/ them too......
it's all good.......

 

[tommyindelaware]

i responded before i read all the other responses.......
looks like teonigil 's got the idea too......

 

[Golem]

No worries - just having a bit of a giggle!

I just checked my Sterling and there is no issue with my playing any of the strings in the 20 - 21 - 22 fret range. They ring clear.

Perhaps there is a tweak you need to make in your set-up, but I couldn't say what - difficult to diagnose within the context of the forum.

A few things that will help get some sort of semi-useful sound from that short fat piece of string:

Less fat, ie lighter guage.

More flexibility, try TI Jazz series or taper core [exposed core].

A good break at the saddle. Slack the tuner a full turn or a bit more. Take a pencil or a really tough finger or whatever and bend that string down right as it exits the saddle groove. [Not required with taper cores.]

The break-at-saddle deal also helps stabilize tuning. Without a good break, a side view of an 'E' or 'B' string usually reveals a slight upward arching of the string as it departs the saddle. This arch is pretty strong but over time is slowly gives way and 'breaks' on its own. All during that extended event, the string involved keeps slowly going flat unless retuned. Not only is the tuning of an unbroken string unstable, but so is the action height, since the arch increases initial action height at the saddle, but then slowly decends. Tone is also affected because the arch is a relatively weak structure forming your witness point. Unless you break the arch [or wait for it to self-break] you don't get the benefit of the really solid bridge that EB and other good builders provide. Even without a switch to more flexible strings, part of the dead thunk-thunk at higher frets is from that arch of the new string. Breaking it will yield a slight improvement.

 

[element]

Will give the pickup height an try tomorrow, thanks guys.