EBMM JP(7) Owners/To Shim or not to...

[SteveB]

Man, Raz.. you like that action low!

I'm too heavy-handed a player to tweak my setup down that low, baby. I can't get my big fingers under the string enough to bend 'em if the action is too low.

I'd like to hear a sound clip of your problem though. Not that I'd know what to do about it, but if I ever end up with the same sound, I'll know what to do!

 

[MikeVt]

it seems radically low from fatory specs. Im kinda proud that we made a guitar that doesnt buzz when set up to this extreme.

Jon, even though I'm extremely happy with my new found abilities to do my own setups, the actual definition of fret buzz still confuses me a bit. When YOU talk about fret buzz, are you talking about immediate interference from the frets in front of the fretted note, or are you talking about the string occasionally rattling against the higher frets when you let a note ring out?

It would seem obvious to me that with low action, no matter how well you dress the frets and set up the guitar, moderate picking pressure is going to result in some level of string/fret rattle - simply because the 'radius' of string vibration is likely to be larger than the action at any particular point on the fretboard. Would this still be referred to as fret buzz?

Mike

 

[Raz]

Raz

Pardon me but I just have to jump in. If you have a lead foot you dont have a hair trigger accelerator. If you have a slow golf swing dont use a stiff shaft. I think that you are so focused on setting up your guitar to the max but that isnt how you play. You should see how some really great players that have a slightly heavier touch set thier guitars up.

I am a bass player first and then a guitarist. I need to have the action and the string gauge a little higher than standard just a titch.

Set your guitar up for maximum performance for your paricular style and touch and you should be happy.

Jon How are the numbers he has. it seems radically low from fatory specs. Im kinda proud that we made a guitar that doesnt buzz when set up to this extreme.

Good point, however since aquiring the JP7 I've been playing a lot lighter, and I still get that...I think the best thing is a sound clip. I also know that when I rest my palm on the lower strings, the low B string instantly sticks to the pup.
When I meant heavy handed I meant I will often get into a groove, picking harder or using more vibrato as I stir up emotion, as with many out there...however when I am cold, and I just pick up the guitar, as I said before, a single note, with a wee bit of movement ( ie vibrato, slide, pull off, any slight movement) creates this low tone backround noise...now I'm going to try and see if it's a bother with the amp cranked...I even tried easing back on the vol.

And BP you should be proud,,,everyone who comes over gets to see how low and amazingly playable my JP 7 is. Hats off to you guys for creating a masterpiece

SteveB Man, Raz.. you like that action low!

I'm too heavy-handed a player to tweak my setup down that low, baby. I can't get my big fingers under the string enough to bend 'em if the action is too low.

I'd like to hear a sound clip of your problem though. Not that I'd know what to do about it, but if I ever end up with the same sound, I'll know what to do!

I'll try and post pics and sound clips. I really appreciate this and I really don't want to raise the action, I wish I can simply lower the pups...

 

[jongitarz]

Jon How are the numbers he has. it seems radically low from fatory specs. Im kinda proud that we made a guitar that doesnt buzz when set up to this extreme.

His numbers are low. Factory specs are 2/32 at the 12th fret. Pretty much industry standard. I like low action. Real low. About 1/32 at the 12th. Thats just like JP has his. There is buzzing on my axes, and JP's also. Acoustic buzz. You can't hear it through the amp, and ANY guitar with really low action will have some acoustic buzz. If you want super low action, you will have to deal with it.

I have said this many times before here, forget measurements. Go by what feels good when you play. If that means really low action, expect some buzzing, or maybe some fretting out when you bend notes to the extreme.

Raz...Post that sound clip. If you can do it tonight and if I'm still around, I would love to hear it. If not, I will listen to it tomorrow night when I get home from work.

 

[MikeVt]

His numbers are low. Factory specs are 2/32 at the 12th fret. Pretty much industry standard. I like low action. Real low. About 1/32 at the 12th. Thats just like JP has his. There is buzzing on my axes, and JP's also. Acoustic buzz. You can't hear it through the amp, and ANY guitar with really low action will have some acoustic buzz. If you want super low action, you will have to deal with it.

I think that answers my question about fret buzz. Acoustic buzz sounds like what I was referring to as string rattle. Thanks Jon!

If not, I will listen to it tomorrow night when I get home from work.

Jon, do you ever REALLY get home from work? If you just log on and answer questions from us, aren't you still working?

Have a nice night all - it's almost midnight here, and I need some sleep!

Mike

 

[jongitarz]

Jon, do you ever REALLY get home from work? If you just log on and answer questions from us, aren't you still working?

Have a nice night all - it's almost midnight here, and I need some sleep!

Mike

No...Working is getting paid. When I respond from home, it's the passion for guitar that I have.

 

[Raz]

His numbers are low. Factory specs are 2/32 at the 12th fret. Pretty much industry standard. I like low action. Real low. About 1/32 at the 12th. Thats just like JP has his. There is buzzing on my axes, and JP's also. Acoustic buzz. You can't hear it through the amp, and ANY guitar with really low action will have some acoustic buzz. If you want super low action, you will have to deal with it.

I have said this many times before here, forget measurements. Go by what feels good when you play. If that means really low action, expect some buzzing, or maybe some fretting out when you bend notes to the extreme.

Raz...Post that sound clip. If you can do it tonight and if I'm still around, I would love to hear it. If not, I will listen to it tomorrow night when I get home from work.

It'll have to wait, the kids are sleeping. I'm experimenting with and comparing it to my EMG 707's. I will get something up as soon as I can...I really appreciate this.

 

[Jimi D]

I don't own a JP, but looking at my guitars and the way they're set up, I would think that a 1/16" clearance between the string and the pickup is way too little... I wouldn't be surprised if you had ghost notes or string noise being picked up if you pickups are that high... I would put in a small shim, raise the bridge, and see if it improves matters - you won't know until you try, and it's not like rocket science or anything... Just remember that a tiny, tiny change in neck angle results in a very pronounced difference in bridge height, so you'll want to use something thin for a slight change - I have used a couple layers of masking tape in the past (3 or 4 pieces of masking tape laid on top of one another) and it's worked pretty well... good luck...

 

[movingpictures]

I sometimes have a similair problem when playing my 7. I found that you need to change your picking hand position slightly in order to mute those lower strings, especially when using distortion. I dont play the 7 as much as i should, and when i do, i need to make this adjustment.

As far as the pup height goes, i have in the past, put foam under the pups. Try something stiff like window moulding foam. It enables you to have direct mounted pups, and still be able to adjust them a little. Hope that helps...

Oh, and if you really get sick of that JP7, ill take it off your hands!!!!!!

 

[Devnor]

Wait a sec... the distance between the pups & string is 1/16" ? That cant be right at all. Aren't the JP pickups fixed like the Axis?

 

[Mick]

No...Working is getting paid. When I respond from home, it's the passion for guitar that I have.

Are u reading this BP.????? Jon come over to germany in my store if you prefer working for food and tequila

 

[MikeVt]

No...Working is getting paid. When I respond from home, it's the passion for guitar that I have.

For what it's worth Jon, everyone here appreciates your passion!!!

Mike

 

[Raz]

OK just to update here, I realize you guys were so helpful and I think well deserving of updates, especially Jon and BP. The good news is I get the same effect with my other sevens, especially the one with the SH-8 invader pups (again all my guitars are set up low, not as low as the Pet of course), however the JP7's was more audible. Secondly and thanks to Chris Bechtel (deadringer) for this, I was able to adjust the pole pieces of the Pet's pups, simply by using the appropriate Allan wrench, allowing for more spacing, pup (or pole piece rather) to string.This can be helpful for other Pet users. Now this never bothered me before, but since selling off my Behringer V-Amp 2.0, and using only the Boss ME-50, I'm really noticing this now. So when the Tonelab gets in, I will investigate further. It seems the problem is related to a few things, and this is what I have determined that, the better pups of these guitars (DiMarzio Custom, Duncan SH-8 Invaders and the EMG 707 pups) coupled with the seventh low B string (the main culpret), and add to that the low action, I believe this vibratory tone becomes a little more audible and disturbing. Again I am attempting to clean up with my right hand, but it's still funny that NOW I am hearing this. Now, and Jon step in any time, I only lowered the pole pieces flush to the pup's surface (about 1 turn and a half). So that's about it, once I get the Vox in, I will get back...thanks to all of you!

 

[MikeVt]

Sounds good Raz. Just out of curiosity, how high were the poles to begin with? Mine are about 1/32 proud of the pup right now.

Good luck - and don't forget to let me know what you think of the tonelab when you get it. I'm really interested to hear your opinion of both the models, and effects...

Mike

 

[Raz]

Sounds good Raz. Just out of curiosity, how high were the poles to begin with? Mine are about 1/32 proud of the pup right now.

Good luck - and don't forget to let me know what you think of the tonelab when you get it. I'm really interested to hear your opinion of both the models, and effects...

Mike

Probably about the same, so like I said I still have the issue, but I was able to gain the 1/32". I tried raising the action...but it's just not right for me. The next step is for me to look under the pup, but I'll wait for the TOnelab...

 

[deadringer]

Glad I could help a little. I've found sometimes the whole thing is a balancing act. Raise this a little, lower that a little, learn to live with this or that, that kind of stuff.

 

[Raz]

Glad I could help a little. I've found sometimes the whole thing is a balancing act. Raise this a little, lower that a little, learn to live with this or that, that kind of stuff.

Well I decided to shim the neck...let me explain. I drastically lowered my pups on my Washburn (the Invaders) and I shimmed the neck a bit giving me plenty o' clearance and the noise has drastically been reduced, so I therefore went ahead and did my Petrucci, well I'm working on it now, cleaning the fretboard, applying some oil and doing the back of the neck at the same time. However I noticed something and I hope Jon is reading this...

Can you PM me please Jon?

Other than that I will report back...

 

[Raz]

OK neck has been shimmed, wax applied and now there is more space between the pups and the strings...actions up a touch but again, one thing at a time. Now I still get thse tones(more subtle now), however I was able to play today (anniversary and my wife was flipping ). I may or may not throw in another shim, but atleast I attacked the situation.

I still need Jon to email or PM ASAP! Thanks!