Luke Tremelo Question.

[davyk]

Hi everyone,
I have a small question about the trem on my TG luke. When i got the guitar it was set to float but over the weekend I decided to have it flush with the body for dive only (like all my other guitars). So I tightened the trem screws inside the back plate (just used the 2 springs) and after tuning etc the bridge was flush to the body.
Problem is the guitar never stayed in tune after using the trem, I stretched the strings (elixir 9-42) to within an inch of their lives but still no good. I had the bridge flush to the body (when resting) but not too stiff for tremelo use and still had slight movement when bending strings.
From what i can remember it was mostly the g string that moved out of tune the most, usually sharp, i dont think there is any obstruction in the nut (and I did lube the nut).
I have since returned to float (I read somewhere that factory setting were g string can be raised 1 1/2 tones when trem is pulled back, so that is where I adjusted to) and the guitar is staying in tune perfect now, but ideally, flush to the body is what I would prefer.
Any theories or ideas would be really appreciated,

Davy

davyk.net - Home

 

[Spudmurphy]

Usually when a floating trem is returned flat to the body, a saddle adjustment is required - this means making the saddles higher. Did you adjust the saddles at all?

 

[davyk]

Hi,
Yeah I raised the saddles a bit to compensate for the action being lower when the bridge was pulled back.
I must say though, since i have her floating the tuning is remarkable, dive bombs, squeals, nothing is phasing this baby.

 

[DrKev]

It's a fantastic trem, and I love it floating, so you can guess what my advice is!

 

[Charles5150]

Actually, you need to set it floating if you want to play the intro and outro of "Better World" by Toto.

I setted up my Axis to float time ago and I've not looked back since.

 

[threeminutesboy]

the trem on my luke is set non floating but I am using 3 springs a played slightly withe saddles

 

[davyk]

ok I take all back,
Done gig on Monday night and the Luke is not staying in tune after trem use. I had a great few days at home playing with the Luke and testing the trem (5 or 10 mins at a time), but after monday night things are not good.
What happened? I dont know, about halfway through the gig I changed guitars and finished the show.
Maybe its playing for long periods of time as in a gig situation, is it the strings do you think (elixir), have I adjusted something wrong when setting up for my taste, Jesus, I want so much to love this guitar but its getting tough.
I really am not the kind of guy who moans about everything (although you wouldnt guess that with my past posts... lol)
Any advice regarding setup etc from you all would be great.

Davy.

 

[mikeller]

Davy - I recommend if at all possible you phone customer service. Understanding that may be difficult, it can be trial and error. I set my Luke up to float and it returns to pitch extremely well. May sure that the claw is adjusted so that the bridge height off the body (when viewed from the body towards the neck) is equal from right to left.

 

[davyk]

Hi Mike,
Thanks for the reply, I have finally dragged myself away from the Luke, having spent all day adjusting, tuning, fixing intonation etc.
As I mentioned earlier, I set the bridge to float 1 and 1/2 semitones above the g when the trem is pulled back but after doing a restring with the same brand of strings the bridge doesn't float as high and am only getting 1 tone above g now????
It's driving me mad.
How are the springs setup on your Luke.

 

[DrKev]

May sure that the claw is adjusted so that the bridge height off the body (when viewed from the body towards the neck) is equal from right to left.

That has nothing to do with the claw but with the two stud screws that the bridge pivots on.

Click here -->Music Man Customer Service

They are the best in the business.

 

[mikeller]

Hi Mike,
Thanks for the reply, I have finally dragged myself away from the Luke, having spent all day adjusting, tuning, fixing intonation etc.
As I mentioned earlier, I set the bridge to float 1 and 1/2 semitones above the g when the trem is pulled back but after doing a restring with the same brand of strings the bridge doesn't float as high and am only getting 1 tone above g now????
It's driving me mad.
How are the springs setup on your Luke.

3 - straight.

Also, see DrKev's below, I meant the stud's, sorry. Again, I highly recommend calling customer service or see a professional set up man.

 

[straycat113]

I agree with Mike and call CS and then take the guitar to the best tech you know. It sounds like you are a hands on type of guy ,but sometimes you come across an issue that is best served by taking it to someone who has more experience than you in this field and getting the guitar handed back to you playing exactly like you expect it to. My tech is one of my best friends with 40 years of experience and all I have to do is explain what the issue is or what I want and when I am handed back the guitar that is what I get.

 

[Craiguitar]

When I got my Luke II brand new (many years ago) It came set up with the bridge set flat against the body. I prefer it floating, but I was hesitant at first to make any setup adjustments, as I just wanted to get playing. A few weeks in I was having problems with string breakage which is unusual, as I never usually suffer from this. I was getting worried. Then I decided it was time for the setup change & put the bridge in it's floating position, altered the saddle heights etc, Job done. No tuning issues an d most importantly, no string breakage ever since!

 

[davyk]

Thanks everyone for the feedback,
I think i am losing my mind at this stage, dont get me wrong when using the trem the guitar still stays in tune, (to the human ear, well mine anyway) but when checking with tuner the pitch has wavered ever so slightly, maybe this is normal, but its just by the way i hear other Luke owners talk about their guitars and how well they stay in tune, that I am judging this one.
I do understand that floating trems will not be as good or as stable as a floyd and that there will be a certain play with the tuning ,is this normal.
Maybe I am paying too much attention on the tuner and not my ears and need to adjust my playing to the Luke (which has the most amazing neck ever btw) and get used to the floating trem and stop tuning at the end of every song
I am beginning to think that the guitar is fine and that its me that is the prob ...lol

Thanks again
Davy

 

[Charles5150]

If it's in tune to your ears, then it's in tune. Tuners are a tool.

Take a look to live performances of world-class players with world-class guitars, they tune between songs or change guitars, even if the last chord of the last song played sounded perfect, they tune and move the machines .....

 

[DrKev]

Maybe I am paying too much attention on the tuner and not my ears and need to adjust my playing to the Luke (which has the most amazing neck ever btw) and get used to the floating trem and stop tuning at the end of every song I am beginning to think that the guitar is fine and that its me that is the prob ...lol

To be honest with you Davy, I think you nailed it. It's so easy with guitars to find ourselves chasing little tiny things, even if we can't hear the difference. The 'flip side' is that sometimes we think we hear a difference when in fact there might be none at all! And some people go the other way entirely - look at most YouTube videos, HORRIBLY out of tune to my ears and they all think it's fine!

But what is "in tune" anyway?

For years the Boss TU-2 was the de-facto standard in pedal tuners and that was only accurate to +/- 3 cents. If the pedal said you were out, it was quite noticeable to many people. If you were using a TU-2 for your Luke, you'd probably never notice a problem at all, because any changes in tuning would be too small for the TU-2 to see!

For live work, +/- 3 cents was OK, but for recording where we pay a lot more attention to tuning, it often didn't do the job very well. If you wanted something really accurate you paid a lot more money, which most people didn't want to do, so we muddled through with what we had - our ears!

In the last couple of years, thanks to people like Peterson and TC Electronic, competition in the tuner market has gotten really tight. Great for us guitarists, as we get more accurate tuners than we've ever had before! Now we're at the stage where +/- 1 cent accuracy is normal (even better on some tuners) at very reasonable prices.

But now many players think that there is something wrong with their instrument because their tuner shows something even if they can't hear it. If you have a tuner that is accurate enough, even a Floyd won't look quite so stable any more! But that doesn't mean it now performs any worse than it already did.

The Music Man trem is my favourite non-locking trem out there and with the locking tuners performs brilliantly. But we have to make sure that new strings are properly stretched in and then eliminate friction. I use the just a smallest amount of lubrication in the nut slots AND where the strings touch the saddles. That does me fine. Does it stay perfectly in tune all of the time? Almost, but no. But I'd still describe it as brilliant tuning stability.

Relax and enjoy your Luke. It's an instrument that will make you play better and enjoy playing more. As you've just realisd, you have to allow yourself to do that though.

 

[Roubster]

DrKev knows what he's talking about...that's why he's a Doctor . The MM trem is one of the best out there and I actually quite miss playing with it on my Silo Special I sold. I actually had better results with tuning when it was floating than when it was flat on the body, plus gives you a nice natural vibrato for chords and such. The worst offender is the G string, but I found that in addition to eliminating friction and stretching the strings like DrKev mentioned is to tune the guitar perfectly with a good tuner, then use the trem and do some wild bends on all strings and then retune. This usually helped me with good tuning stability even with some heavy trem use and wild bends. Just have fun with the guitar and dont look at the tuner all the time.