MarkBass Cabs Question

[oli@bass]

I know, I know... it's the MusicMan forum, BUT... it's because of several raving posts here that I'm acutally thinking of replacing my whole SWR rig (actually two rigs!) with MarkBass. And I guess with that many (MM) bass players, some might be able to add valuable bits information.

My current rigs:

A) For all sorts of gigs (one or two cabs, depending on stage size)

• Studio 220
• 2 x Goliath Jr II (2 x 10" & Tweeter)

B) Main amp for rehearsal room and large gigs

• GrandPrix
• Stereo 800
• Henry The 8 (8 x 8" & Tweeter)

A collection of more or less unrelated thoughts and feelings on my sound situation:

• I quite dislike rig A): Although it should be pretty flexible, I never get a sound I truly like. It doesn't cut through when things get loud, and it never sounds "tight".
  
• I do like some of the characteristics of rig B), especially the 8x8 cab: It cuts through, sounds tight, and can be as loud as you need it. However, it's too heavy and too large to take everywhere.
  
• For my last gig, I had a borrowed elderly Ampeg SVT / 8x10 amp and cab on stage, and I simply loved it together with the StingRay. That experience made me rethink my whole amplification situation and have a look at the current opportunities.
  
• What I like about the old Ampeg 8x10 "refrigerator" cab is the mighty sound, and the presence. However, with that weight and size it is out of question for me.
  
• What currently appeals most to me about the MarkBass cabs is their weight (or absence thereof). I wasn't able to test them, since I've not yet seen the cabs (only the small combos) in a shop nearby.

So I was thinking of doing something less conventional... stacking 4 Traveller 102P (2 x 10") cabs on top of each other, to get the Ampeg "wall of sound", yet can downsize if needed, plus every single piece of equipment is lightweight. Also, replace the GrandPrix/Stereo 800 with a SansAmp RBI (to get some of the Ampeg "vibe" also on the D.I.) and an MarkBass F1.


Does that make any sense?

 

[Psycho Ward]

I still like my Bergantino cab's, but I'm using them mostly for my keyboard rig, they kill with keys though. I have not been able to get my hands on any of the MarkBass cab's but the 610 looks like what I'd like. The 810e with my LMII will know you down with a smile on your face, but as you said... Heavy!

I like the multi-cab approach, just carry what you need. For some reason I want an Ampeg 18 cab, I'd love to hear what the MarkBass head could do with that.

 

[Aussie Mark]

Oli, we're in similar territory in the cab department. I have two Goliath Jrs that I use for rehearsal and small gigs, and a Henry the 8x8 that is my main gigging cab. Having used Ampeg fridges at gigs where backline was supplied I actually prefer the Henry, plus Henry is 70lbs lighter than a fridge.

Your idea of buying a wall of four 2x10 cabs makes sense in theory, but in practice a stack of 2x10's will sound quite different to a pair of 4x10's or an Ampeg style 8x10. Not having heard the Markbass 2x10 cabs I can't advise you on that course of action. Hopefully Pete Murray will chime in and share his thoughts.

In the amp department I run a LMII for rehearsal and small gigs, and an Acoustic Image Focus 1 (800 watts @ 4 ohms, 6lbs) for large gigs.

 

[DTG]

4 2x10 cabs,not sure how the ohm bit will work out,mark bass will only go down to 4ohm.if you have 4 8ohm cabs will the load not be 2ohm ??
Peter is the man for this !

me,I am still going with a MB 4x10 at 4 ohm,and for bigger gigs using the exact same rig again two LMII heads and two 4x10 4 ohm cabs....

I too have made the switch from SWR and love it,However the SWR super redhead is still a great amp,just not as loud or as clear as MB gear.

 

[LowDownDave]

4 2x10 cabs,not sure how the ohm bit will work out,mark bass will only go down to 4ohm.if you have 4 8ohm cabs will the load not be 2ohm ??

Not if you daisy chain the cabs correctly. I think if you connected two 8 ohm cabs to the head, and another 8 ohm cab to each of the already connected cabs, you'd still end up with a 4 ohm load total (I think). And you'd be pushing more air. Awesome, though more costly than I'd ever want/need.

 

[Aussie Mark]

Not if you daisy chain the cabs correctly. I think if you connected two 8 ohm cabs to the head, and another 8 ohm cab to each of the already connected cabs, you'd still end up with a 4 ohm load total (I think).

That's very unlikely. Every bass cabinet I've ever seen is wired so that daisy chaining another cab is in parallel, not series, so two 8 ohm cabs will result in a 4 ohm load. The third 8 ohm cab will bring it down to 2.67 ohms, and the fourth would make it 2 ohms.

 

[SLUGGO]

Last night I gigged my MarkBass rig for the first time. I have loved it in rehearsal, but it really shined live!

My rig is a LMII with the Traveler 2x10 and the 1X15HF. This rig kills!!!

If you get a cab combo similar to this you will not be disappointed! The absolute clearest, punciest rig I have ever played through! There have been a few negative posts here and there about the larger MB cabs....but I don't agree. The low end booms, crisp highs, and cutting mids...how can you beat it?

 

[LowDownDave]

That's very unlikely. Every bass cabinet I've ever seen is wired so that daisy chaining another cab is in parallel, not series, so two 8 ohm cabs will result in a 4 ohm load. The third 8 ohm cab will bring it down to 2.67 ohms, and the fourth would make it 2 ohms.

Oops, I guess I messed that one up. I've never actually done this, so I guess my interpretation was incorrect. But I thought there was a way to connect cabinets so the impedance is doubled (or am I way off and this is impossible)?

This suggests with most amps having two outputs, plugging an 8 ohm cab into each output (total impedance 4 ohms?) would give the same power as plugging only one 8 ohm cab into the amp and a second 8 ohm cab into the first? I is confuseded...

 

[smallequestrian]

Oops, I guess I messed that one up. I've never actually done this, so I guess my interpretation was incorrect. But I thought there was a way to connect cabinets so the impedance is doubled (or am I way off and this is impossible)?

This suggests with most amps having two outputs, plugging an 8 ohm cab into each output (total impedance 4 ohms?) would give the same power as plugging only one 8 ohm cab into the amp and a second 8 ohm cab into the first? I is confuseded...

You can get a series cable but then you are still not in an optimal impedance range with 8ohm cabs. You would connect one 2x10 to each speaker output on the amp. Then you connect another 2x10 to the open jack on the 2x10 with a series cable. So:

(2x10 (in series) 2x10) in parallel with ((2x10 (in series) 2x10))
=
((8ohm + 8ohm) + (8ohm + 8ohm)) / 4
=
8 ohm load on amp

Of course if you had four 4ohm 2x10's then you could get a 4 ohm load this way.

 

[smallequestrian]

This suggests with most amps having two outputs, plugging an 8 ohm cab into each output (total impedance 4 ohms?) would give the same power as plugging only one 8 ohm cab into the amp and a second 8 ohm cab into the first? I is confuseded...

Yes.

 

[oli@bass]

Thanks for your inputs everyone.

Regarding the impedance of cabs:
- normal daisychaining will connect them in parallel, which means that the impedance will be added like 1/4 + 1/4 and then the reciprocal = 2 Ohm
- cabs could also be connected in series, which would add the impedance, e.g. 4 + 4 = 8 Ohm

AFAIK, if an amp has two speaker outputs, they are independent from each other, i.e. you could add two 8 ohm cabs to each!

However, as already said, it would be great if Peter could chime in and provide some insights.

 

[smallequestrian]

AFAIK, if an amp has two speaker outputs, they are independent from each other, i.e. you could add two 8 ohm cabs to each!

They are not independent to each other. Adding two 8ohm cabs to each would result in a 2 ohm load.

To put it more plainly, connecting an 8 ohm cab to each output on the amp is the same as connecting one 8 ohm cab to an output and connecting another 8 ohm cab to the first 8 ohm cab; a 4 ohm load.

 

[oli@bass]

Ooops... this is news to me! Wasn't aware of that, most probably because my SWRs work with as low as a 2 ohm impedance.

 

[LowDownDave]

Cheers for the explanation, little horsey guy (I think I've heard you called that before).

I think I need to go back to math class to understand all this. I never did pass Physics 101, but I'm sure I would've paid more attention if the coursework involved amps and speakers! But I don't think I'll ever need more than 2 cabinets, so I suppose I'll stay in the "ignorance is bliss" camp.

Good luck oli@bass. I too am thinking of going with 2x10's, but don't anticipate ever needing more than two of them for my gigging situations. I guess if cost is no option you could get 2x F1's (not much weight difference with 2) or get 2x 4x10's rated at 8ohms each (a heavier option) to accomplish your lightweight WALL OF SOUND.

 

[fortvideo]

I was thinking about a Mark Bass Combo so I don't have to lug around my 18" to practice. I know they are available at some Guitar Centers, but can you buy them on line?

 

[mynan]

I was thinking about a Mark Bass Combo so I don't have to lug around my 18" to practice. I know they are available at some Guitar Centers, but can you buy them on line?

Last time I checked, GC was the only US distributor and they didn't offer them online, but that may have changed. They went from being available at only 3 stores to over 50 in only a couple of months. If your local GC doesn't carry them, they should be able to order what you need from another store that does.

 

[Rano Bass]

Just get the 6x10 and be happy with it
Pretty loud!

 

[oli@bass]

Good luck oli@bass.

Thanks...

I too am thinking of going with 2x10's, but don't anticipate ever needing more than two of them for my gigging situations. I guess if cost is no option you could get 2x F1's (not much weight difference with 2) or get 2x 4x10's rated at 8ohms each (a heavier option) to accomplish your lightweight WALL OF SOUND.

Cost is an issue. And I don't need that much wattage.
The main problem is: I like to have a wall of sound, because I can actually make it less loud and still hear myself very clearly. Might be due to the linear character of the sound source, but also because some of the speakers are simply closer to the ears... (my knees do not receive sound as well, but that's where most of the cabs are blowing at)

Second problem: Two 4x10 won't fit into my car...


Other options I've found so far are:
- Phil Jones Bass Piranhas... 4x5"... now that looks cute
- Ashdown 4x8" cabs (less expensive, good looking and maybe a good compromise)

I really don't know... and there's hardly a place where I can test all of them cabs... most shops do have them on their pricelist but not available for checking out. First move is to let the 2x10" SWRs go and use The Henry as my main cab all the time.

 

[oli@bass]

Just get the 6x10 and be happy with it
Pretty loud!

Loud is not exactly the problem. Loud'n'clear is

The 6x10 does not have three things I'm looking for:

1.) have the topmost speakers closer to the ears (instead of the knees)
2.) lower weight per cab
3.) flexibility to take along as much equipement as I need


I know... I sound like being difficult here... dammit... but it's really not easy.

 

[DTG]

just dont rush into in,take the time even if it takes a few months to try as many as you can.
have fun !!