NGD Cutlass BFR Blue Magic/ Pickup Issues?

[milosjak]

So, after looking around on reverb for a good used deal on one of the HSS BFR cutlasses I got a brand new Blue Magic HSS as the used ones from US would cost me in shipping enough that I just went with a new one.
Pretty good impression so far, although it came with insanely high action for a guitar of this caliber. Hopefully, adjusting the truss rod will get it down, as it seems it was pretty loose.

Another thing that got me a bit perplexed are the pickups. When I get used to the sound of the singles and I switch to the humbucker it sounds muffled. Almost like the singles are louder than the humbucker. Which isn't probably the case, but just that such bright singles go through more easily through a broken up marshall than a humbucker. I've checked with my other himbucker equipped guitar to make sure there's nothing wrong. I think it's just that there is a drastic difference between the sound of the singles and the humbucker.
Anyone had such an experience?

The neck shape is the best I've tried so far, love it.

Thanks

 

[milosjak]

Here are some images of it:

https://imgur.com/ENLW02g

https://imgur.com/rPfMrDH

https://imgur.com/4hcuqZv

https://imgur.com/PMWB5Y0

 

[QuietSpike]

Weird about the humbucker.

I’ve got 2 cutlasses, but one is SSS and the other is the Bull Head with a dimarzio humbucker (which I’m pretty sure is different than the regular HSS).

The action on both of mine are very low and comfortable. Through a combination of saddle height and truss adjustments, you should find what you’re looking for with action.

How high is the humbucker? I raised the dimarzio a little and made a difference for me. Maybe try that?

 

[QuietSpike]

Another thought… how high are your single coils?

My middle coil is darn near flush with the pick guard. That might balance it a little better?

Love that color my man

 

[racerx]

Beautiful Cutlass! I’ve owned and own a few and absolutely adore them.

Regarding action/setup - this is sort of trivial and really depends on the storage and care of it before it arrived to you. The factory does a great job shipping them out in the right shape, but sitting in a box in a warehouse can take its toll. The good news is truss rod adjustments are quick and painless.

As for pickups - try replacing the battery just in case. Otherwise you can experiment with the pickup height to find the sweet spot. The humbucker (unless you run is different) isn’t overly aggressive and is mated well with the single coils. If you’re expecting in your face aggressiveness, then the Bull Head (other BFR run) or another high output pickup might be in your wheelhouse. I bought the Bull Head based on Dibart’s review a few weeks back and love the Axis pickup. My other HSS Cutlass was definitely more in the vintagey space.

 

[milosjak]

Hey guys, thanks for all the responses.

I've got the action sorted pretty easy. I didn't expect that the saddle height makes such a drastic difference at 12th fret. I actually had to undo it a bit as it became quite low for my taste.

As for the pickup balance I'm still strugling with that part. The thing is the singles are pretty bright, which I really actually like. But then when I switch to the humbucker it just sounds dead. In order to get it balanced I have to change the tone pot on the singles to about 6-7. When I've heard they've balanced this set I thought the bridge pickup is lower output and bright, but it sounds like it doesn't have enough brightness to compete with the singles.

As for the pickup height, my bridge is at 2mm from the strings, middle about 5mm, and neck about 4.5-5mm. That's measured from the string to the top of the pole piece, without any strings pressed.

 

[milosjak]

I've just done extensive comparison to my EVH Wolfgang bridge humbucker, and the Wolfgang is much brighter than the cutlass bridge.
Sure it's apples to oranges comparison but I would've assumed that the higher output wolfgang would be darker than a lower output that's supposedly in the cutlass.
I don't know, do you guys think there might be something wrong with it? And how would I know? I'm assuming this is normal, but there's noise when I'm in the bridge + middle position. Also, the middle and neck single positions aren't really silent the same way the bridge is, but I'm assuming that's also normal. I did change the battery by the way.
I've tried getting the bridge lower, but then it sounds plain broken in comparison to the singles.

Thanks again

 

[elvisdog]

So I don't know how relevant any of this is, but I swapped pick guards on my StingRay guitar and when I reassembled it, I left the pickups pretty much flush with the pick guard, intending to adjust them later. But surprise! I love the way they sound this low, nice and bright and spanky. Not sure if the humbucker in the Cutlass is the same design, but if it is, maybe start with the bridge all the way down, then adjust the single coils to match the volume & see where you're at.

 

[TripHazard]

Could you record any sound clips and give us a link to them perhaps? May also be useful if you need to get in touch with EBMM or the store you purchased from

 

[DrKev]

I've just done extensive comparison to my EVH Wolfgang bridge humbucker, and the Wolfgang is much brighter than the cutlass bridge.
Sure it's apples to oranges comparison but I would've assumed that the higher output wolfgang would be darker than a lower output that's supposedly in the cutlass.
I don't know, do you guys think there might be something wrong with it? And how would I know? I'm assuming this is normal, but there's noise when I'm in the bridge + middle position. Also, the middle and neck single positions aren't really silent the same way the bridge is, but I'm assuming that's also normal. I did change the battery by the way.
I've tried getting the bridge lower, but then it sounds plain broken in comparison to the singles.

Thanks again

I find my Cutlass is a little darker than my other guitars. That said the others are also bright sounding guitars (modified Silhouette Special and a MIJ 62RI strat) so take a pinch of salt there. But, I have an idea about this.

Remember that the cutlass has a built-in buffer circuit, which means it always sounds the same no matter what length cable you use. But other guitars don't behave that way, which means the cable you use is important when making comparisons. Now, I do know that EBMM simulate cable capacitance in the buffer circuit (it sounds way too bright if you don't). They wont tell me more (trade secret) but I think they chose simulate a long cable run, e.g. like many artists use on a big stage, which naturally mean less highs. So, a better comparison would be to use a longer cable (20ft or 30ft) with your other guitar to whatever it is plugged into. If you use a short, low capacitance cable with your other guitar, it will naturally sound brighter.

FWIW, I used to use a 10ft planet waves cable at home, very low capacitance, but it made my other guitars sound very bright next to the Cutlass. I changed to the Ernie Ball cables, which are higher capacitance, and I'm now much happier switching between guitars now. Basically I can choose how bright I want the other guitars to be by choosing my cable.

Re: the silent circuit, it's never perfectly silent, that's totally normal. A 70% reduction is about right. No similar noise cancelling system on the market does much better. So, your single coils will never be quiet as a humbucker. Obviously the more distortion you play with the more obvious that becomes. Next time you have an opportunity to look under the pickguard, there are two small adjustment pots (one for the neck pickup, one for the middle pickup) that allow you to adjust the noise cancelling.

 

[DrKev]

Also, I highly recommend adjusting the bass to treble balance of the pickups, i.e. the side-to-side angle under the strings. I think it's more important than just about any other adjustment you can make with a pickup.

 

[milosjak]

OK guys, with a bit more experimentation and a lot of good suggestions and ideas (and general info on what to look out for) I think I finally managed to get the things balanced.
The comparison to the EVH was indeed with a short cable so that did give the EVH brightness advantage. Things changed once I put it through my true bypass pedal run.
It seems that the problem here isn't with the humbucker itself, as it actually sounds really good when I compare it to the EVH bridge. The thing is that this bridge is a bit less output (although surprisingly not that much less compared to the EVH bridge), and so it changed how it reacted to my amp setup.
I first had to change the power tubes, funnily enough, because if I started cranking the master volume on my marshall astoria custom it started to get some weird noise going on. When I switched these "NOS" el34 with the stock KT66 I could crank the master volume more, which gave me a beefier sound on the singles and more output on the bridge so they got more even. Then I backed off the bridge pickup since I had it at 2mm, which did seem to kill off some sustain. I did this by ear, and when I measured it was at 3mm.
Then what I had to do is not try to balance the singles based on the output or gain amount, but basically the bass response. In the end I lowered the singles a bit to control the boomines of the low end, as otherwise it "sounded" much louder compared to the bridge just because of the frequency response difference.

I think I really like it now. I never would've cranked either the master volume or the gain on my amp with my EVH, but with this guitar I can, and it doesn't become mud. I'm guessing this is what people talk about when they talk about how they'd rather have lower output pickups and let the amp do it's work. It's much more natural and fuller sounding.

Also, I highly recommend adjusting the bass to treble balance of the pickups, i.e. the side-to-side angle under the strings. I think it's more important than just about any other adjustment you can make with a pickup.

I'm still fine tuning, but any suggestions on this part are welcome. How are you guys having this balanced? Is the one side of the pickup closer to the strings than the other? I got it pretty much even right now.
I guess while I'm asking for your setups, I might as well ask about the general pickup height. How high did you get your hss setup?

P.S. The guitar got to me with a broken hard case. One corner literally had a piece break from it. Luckily 0 damage on guitar but I'm going through a claim process with the shop that I ordered it from. Luckily that gets sorted soon as I can't even close this one.

Oh and sorry, last question, I promise: I didn't get any allen keys with the guitar. I'm strugling to find one in my toolbox that's long enough to adjust the tremolo arm. What size should I be looking for when buying?

Again, thanks everyone for very constructive feedback. I'm getting more and more in love with this thing.

 

[DrKev]

I'm still fine tuning, but any suggestions on this part are welcome. How are you guys having this balanced? Is the one side of the pickup closer to the strings than the other? I got it pretty much even right now.
I guess while I'm asking for your setups, I might as well ask about the general pickup height. How high did you get your hss setup?

Oh and sorry, last question, I promise: I didn't get any allen keys with the guitar. I'm struggling to find one in my toolbox that's long enough to adjust the tremolo arm. What size should I be looking for when buying?

Again, thanks everyone for very constructive feedback. I'm getting more and more in love with this thing.

Standard Music Man factory setup is 4/32" bridge pickup, 5/32" middle pickup, and 6/32" neck pickup (3.2 mm, 4.0 mm, and 4.75 mm) measured from top of the pole pieces to bottom of open E string. People usually adjust a little closer on the treble side. Personally, for me it can change day to day, depends on amp/pedal settings and may be very different for each pickup. I have a screwdrivers in my desk drawer and in my gigbag and I adjust whenever I feel the need. Sometimes my humbucker is set really low to balance with the singles for low gain work. Just try to use your ears and not your eyes (difficult, I know).

1.5 mm hex key for the saddle height screws and trem arm. Put the trem arm in, push it all the way down so the back of the bridge comes up, hold it there, and with your other hand adjust the screw. I've had no difficulty with standard length hex keys. 2 mm hex key for the intonation screws.

 

[milosjak]

I've dialed this thing as close as I can.
There is still some perceived volume difference. I think it comes down to the fact that the singles have wider frequency spectrum, more bass and more treble than the humbucker, and since the circuit keeps it at unity volume, those extra frequencies make it sound louder.
Is there any way that I could mess with the circuit and it's unity volume of the two single coils? What's that trimpot for?

 

[DrKev]

No, the circuit has nothing to do with volume. The trimpots are noise cancelling adjustment.