OT: Smaller Amps With Good Tone?

[ruso]

Since there really isn't a sub-forum in the Gear Talk section for other gear, I figured this would be the best place for this question...

I'm in the market for a good amp for my practice room. I'm not looking for something small like one of those Roland Cubes, but somehting with some balls. I recently auditioned a used Mesa Boogie Road King and was absolutely floored by the huge tones it was capable of. However, like most tube amps, I really had to push the volume levels pretty high to achieve some good sounds. For residential levels, the Road King just won't work. That thing was loud... REAL LOUD! So, moving on I took a look at another Mesa Boogie, the infamous Mark IV. I played it through a 2x12 cabinet and got to really open it up. It didn't have the bottom end that the Road King combo had but damn, the clean and lead tones were unbelievable! But still, I really had to rail on it to get it to sound decent.

So here I am... looking for the perfect amp for my practice room that will give me similar tones to the amps listed above but without having to wake the entire neighborhood up to get a decent tone. I'm really looking for a tone similar to modern day Petrucci. Can any of you guys give me some recommendations? Are any of the smaller Mesa Boogie amps worth looking at or should I look elsewhere.

Thanks!

 

[candid_x]

I had a Mesa Subway Rocket, which was well made and sounded pretty cool. Not being a Mesa, EL84 or 10" speaker fan, I sold it.

Soldano makes a nice 16 watter called the Astroverb. I had the head, and it was another well make amp, capable of a few really good sounds... had a distinct Allman Bros. vibe. But, again, an EL84 powered amp. Sold it too.

Orange's Tiny Terror has gained a following. Never tried it.

 

[MusicManJP6]

I have owned a few smaller amps - Vox AD30VT, Roland Cube 30, Line 6 Spider III 15, and my current Mesa F-30. The F-30 is a killer little amp. It has (1) 12" speaker and (2) EL84's. I think it sounds great and is about the most portable tube amp combo i've been able to find so far. I use an array of effects to get all the tones I want out of it. It's louder than all get out though! I can barely even crank the master. It sounds good at low volumes, but sounds better as you turn it up...

For modeling, the VOX was pretty sweet, but the Spider III was easier to get good tones out of...

 

[leftyguitarblue]

i've had this little 15 watt Peavey Blazer 158 that I have used for probably 15 years that has great crunch even at low volumes. I've even done some home recording with it and it sounds great. Don't know if they even make it anymore.

 

[73h Nils]

Well, from what I've read/tried, any Mesa, even the Express Series with the 5 Watt power option have all been REALLY loud for in-home use. I love the F series a lot, but still, you're talking volume with any Mesa Boogie. I have a Line 6 Spider II 15 for practicing; it gets the job done admirably. I don't understand the flak these things get. It's not a tube amp, so it won't sound close to a Mesa, but you can get really nice tones out of it at reasonable volumes.

 

[greenwizard]

I've been fairly impressed with the Mesa Express 5:50 so I just bought one from Jeff at Ye Olde Music Shoppe, I'll send you a PM when I get it and have tried it out if you'd like.

 

[dannymusic]

small amp BIG attitude; specially through a 4x12

 

[RocketRalf]

You should maybe try some of the Damage Control stuff. They have some highly rated preamplifiers that you could run into any sound system or clean amp. They also have two different dual channel distortion boxes. All of them all-tube. I'm personally waiting for a Solid Metal distortion to arrive, which I plan to run through a F*nder Blues Jr. that sounds amazing on clean settings and bedroom level. I'll post my impressions if it ever gets past customs...

 

[Sub1 Zero]

The Vox AD's, like the one in my sig, are killer amps and are going for painfully cheap right now. They have a wattage regulator on the back (from less than a watt to 50 watts, incredibly useful), and the speakers are great too. I'm amazed that an amp this inexpensive can make me this happy

 

[Sweat]

Being a self admitted amp dummy, I have come a long way in that department, I was looking for the same as you a small amp that sounded great at lower volumes and could get loud if needed. I tried several cheaper SS amps, a Epi Valve Jr and a Mesa 5:50, the solid states just did not cut it, the Epi was nice but not versatile enough, the Mesa well you already know about.

Amps are very personal but i can recommend the Soldano Astoverb Combo, for me it is perfect, compact size, 1x12, can handle an extension cab, single channel so you dont have to spend all day jacking with settings, true reverb tank, handles processors and effects great all my EBMM guitars sound great through it, I am very pleased obviously with this amp, only draw back may be your budget, it is not cheap but hand made botique amps are not cheap, quality costs.

Well thats my 2 cents and if you are interested DuBaldo music is a Soldano distributor, Pete or Nick can hook you up.

 

[robelinda2]

i'm pretty darn happy with my new Carvin Vintage 16, can switch down to 5 watts, very classy tone. not a metal amp though!

 

[Smellybum]

Anybody put an AL through an older champ??? - I'm desperate to try one with my AL - I reckon it'd be great

 

[Ponch]

I think Orange amp the small one would be cool for you. I tried it before and I love it!

 

[ruso]

Thank you for all of your recommendations guys. I was talking to a co-worker this afternoon and he brought something to my attention. I wasn't aware that by using the Mark IV's master volume control I would have the ability to drive the tubes harder but at the same time regulate the volume level. Would this work similar to a hot plate? I'm wondering if combined with a single or dual 12" cabinet if that would be the ticket.

Sorry for my ignorance, it's been over 15 years since I shopped for an amp.

 

[poj]

Yes, you can get good tone at low volume. Try Marshall JVM 410H with 4x12 cab, it does has a good master volume and good tone.

For small amp, I like my Fender Champion 600 very much. Got very nice clean, perfect for bedroom amp. Not sure if it's too small for you, though.

 

[ruso]

See, that's my problem. My last amp was an Ampeg 2x8 combo with a single 12ax7 and had absolutely no bottom end or punch whatsoever. I'm starting to think that for the sake of tone, I should probably just get what I want, but at the same time try and keep the volume down. I guess it'd be kind of a waste of a head and cabinet but then again, I really didn't need to buy this new JP7 did I?

Do 2x12 cabinets have similar characteristics to a full 4x12 cabinet? It would seem to me that the 4x12 would have more bottom end. But given my experience in the home and car audio, technically the 2x12 should have similar frequency response if the internal volume is exactly half of its 4x12 counterpart. Hmm...

 

[Sweat]

See, that's my problem. My last amp was an Ampeg 2x8 combo with a single 12ax7 and had absolutely no bottom end or punch whatsoever. I'm starting to think that for the sake of tone, I should probably just get what I want, but at the same time try and keep the volume down. I guess it'd be kind of a waste of a head and cabinet but then again, I really didn't need to buy this new JP7 did I?

Do 2x12 cabinets have similar characteristics to a full 4x12 cabinet? It would seem to me that the 4x12 would have more bottom end. But given my experience in the home and car audio, technically the 2x12 should have similar frequency response if the internal volume is exactly half of its 4x12 counterpart. Hmm...

Well another reason i can recommend the Soldano, has botom end upper and lots of punch, it containd 5-12AX7 and to El84's on the output side.

 

[beej]

Amp shopping is just tough. There are a million amps out there at all price points and with all manner of features. So you've got to ask yourself what you really need out of this amp, and how much are you willing to spend.

If you just want a practice amp and don't want to gig, then you've got a lot of options. (Something like a Pod is ideal in that situation too, as you can get a wide range of sounds and play with headphones, etc.)

If you want something you're going to play with the band, then you're in a different ball game. You need to factor in how much wattage you need, # of channels, FX loops, etc.

The big problem with big amps is that most don't sound good at low volumes. You can turn up the gain and get the preamp cooking, but much of the sounds we love come from the harmonics produced by an output section that's being pushed hard. There are a few ways to get that at lower volumes- power scaling (I have a Suhr Badger with PS and it kills at all volumes), attenuators (my Guytron has a novel approach to attenuation/slaving), etc and each has it's merits. Some master volumes work well, some are terrible, depends on the design. Getting distortion from the Phase Inverter helps get you there- the post phase inverter MVs (PPIMV) I've heard are great on the right amp. The combination of a good MV and attenuator is often enough to tame a great amp and make it suitable for playing at home.

As for cabinets, there are some great 2x12s out there. An open back cab next to a wall will give you great bass response due to the standing waves. Less so when you move it out into the open, though. Closed back cabs have lots of "thump" but are directional. Ported cabs can be a good solution. I have a ported 1x12 (Suhr) that sounds HUGE and has lots of bass. Port City make an excellent ported 2x12 (and 1x12). 4x12s look great, but they're quite impractical for a home practice rig unless you have the space. Not to mention it's hard to get enough volume at home to get those speakers working.

Since you like the Mesa sound, the recommendation about the Express sounds solid. They've got switchable wattage, come in a combo and have that characteristic sound. But there are a million amps that could work.

Just putting my two cents into the ring here. Think of everything you really need and your budget and hit the stores

 

[GWDavis28]

small amp BIG attitude; specially through a 4x12

These things have a huge rep!!! Sweet design and the packaging is awesome!!

Glenn |B)

 

[JMB27]

small amp BIG attitude; specially through a 4x12

damn that is so cool .... gotta get one!

thanks for posting