pre EBMM stingray

[stamos]

Just bought a pre EBMM stingray with serial number "B 021616". I know that after Fender's bad relation with musicman the production moved to Jackson Charvel factory.

Is there any way I can find out the exact year or factory (fender or jackson) it was produced?

Dates on woods show the production year or not?

 

[Rod Trussbroken]

Your bass will be be circa 1983.

You'll find dates on the neck heel and in the neck pocket on the body but you have to have the neck removed to view them.

Poduction is post Leo Fender

Oh...and welcome to the Forum

 

[stamos]

Thanks rod

Generally, Fender stingrays are considered better than post fender ones?
ARe the any particular problems reported for the Jackson stingrays compared to the fender stingrays?(woods,electrical parts )
I read somewhere about the incident with the problematic fender necks. Do we know the problematic serial numbers?

Also, Is there any possibility that the bass is a Jackson production but the woods are fender made?

 

[strummer]

Generally, "fender" Musicman instruments are less consistent and has some weird things going on, like 3-bolt, bullet truss and string retainer where it doesn't do a lot of good, but theyŕe really really old. newer basses are much more consistent and has had major upgrades since the early days. I'd go for new any day, but they are all good
The messed up necks were, i think, unusable and thus scrapped.

 

[Rod Trussbroken]

Thanks rod

Generally, Fender stingrays are considered better than post fender ones?
ARe the any particular problems reported for the Jackson stingrays compared to the fender stingrays?(woods,electrical parts )
I read somewhere about the incident with the problematic fender necks. Do we know the problematic serial numbers?

Also, Is there any possibility that the bass is a Jackson production but the woods are fender made?

You'd have to check the date recorded in the neck pocket on the body to see who made it. The Leo Fender Sting Rays went from 1976 to the end of 1979. The Charvel/Jackson period went from 1980 to 1983. Ernie Ball bought Music Man in 1984.

There were some necks during the Charvel/Jackson period that had faulty truss rods that didn't work at all. That was around 1981-82. I don't think either of the two Pre-EB periods was better than the other.

 

[Chuck B]

Mr. strummer, Sir, my 1978 Ray does have the three bolt micro tilt neck adjustment and it works. It's still working after 33 years.

 

[stamos]

If no major differences appear between a fender and a Jackson period bass appear, how can we explain the huge price difference between a 1982 and a 1979 stingray?
I had mine for 1800 dol and a similar 1979 costs above 3000.!!!!

 

[strummer]

Mr. strummer, Sir, my 1978 Ray does have the three bolt micro tilt neck adjustment and it works. It's still working after 33 years.

Oh, I know it works Chuck, but you have to admit it's not the greatest neck attachment in the world

 

[2ndBassGuitar]

Oh, I know it works Chuck, but you have to admit it's not the greatest neck attachment in the world

We are getting advise on how to build things better from someone from the country that gave us IKEA??? ;-) My 70's Stingrays work great.

 

[strummer]

We are getting advise on how to build things better from someone from the country that gave us IKEA??? ;-) My 70's Stingrays work great.

No you're getting an observation

 

[rutgart]

Stamos,
My 2 cents worth on the topic of why the cost are so difference (and I'm not an expert or anywhere as knowledgable as Rod or a number of the other senior members not to mention BP or any of his employees).

Would be that the early Instrument is valued high due to being part of the "Leo Fender" phase of the evolution of the Stingray.

 

[stamos]

Almost double price, just beacuse this is a fender bass and not a jackson one?
I can't find it logical. There must be some other reason (qualitywise maybe) too.

Is there anybody here willing to give 3600usd for a 1978 stingray and decline a 1982one for 1800usd? Can you tell us why?

 

[drTStingray]

There is no easy answer to this but I guess this is all part of the 'vintage market' hoodoo. Applies to other famous makes as well. Some people won't go near a Stingray unless it's a 77 model - a Jazz unless it's a 64 etc etc!! IMO, much of what's spoken is nonsense as far as I can see and from having played some of these - but often grows from a rumour/opinion to almost become a general fact - and this may affect market prices, which are just based on what people are willing to pay (or to sell for).

I think the only major technical difference with the post 80 ish basses is that they no longer have a strings through body bridge, and the neck joint is four bolt rather than 3. This may affect sound/sustain a little but not fundamentally. I think I'm right in saying that all of the Cutlass basses (Stingray with graphite neck) were post Leo, and that period also introduced a wider colour range to the basses (red at least?).

I owned a 79 ish Ray from new with strings through body bridge and four bolt neck attachment - it was a great bass and p****d all over any Fender at that time. I believe that my EBMM Classic Ray does everything that bass did, but is also a whole lot better constructed - oh and the neck's a whole lot prettier. It's a great bass in itself, covers the vintage sound exactly, but I don't have the potential maintenance issues I might have with owning and using anything vintage on a day to day basis. I like classic cars but not enough to drive one on a day to day basis!!

There can be technical issues with the Leo 3 bolt with tilt adjustment neck attachment which are well documented and can affect neck level at the upper register (they affect the 70's Jazz bass as well, from which the method was brought to Musicman).

 

[Chuck B]

I do agree. That's that "vintage hype" making fools out of men.

 

[Golem]

Almost double price, just beacuse this is a fender
bass and not a jackson one? I can't find it logical.
There must be some other reason (qualitywise
maybe) too.

Is there anybody here willing to give 3600usd for
a 1978 stingray and decline a 1982one for 1800usd?
Can you tell us why?

I won't touch a deal that includes collectors' value,
sentimental value, cult value, etc ... and that goes
equally for "vintage" and/or new/recent "Limited" or
"Special Edition" products.

I do own/play some of the vintage or LE/SE basses,
but they came my way at player-value-only prices.
EBMM-wise, my now-gone Sabre cost me $400 and
my Ray 30th was about $1000 [brand new].

Buy your basses as players, and judge fair market
value by comparison with very similar basses that
are clearly NOT collectibles.

 

[OldManMusic]

My '78 Ray doesn't sound $2K better than a new/used post-EB bass. The new Classic series feels very much like my old '78. But I bought mine in 1978 and have sweat on it, nicked it, bled on it, deflected drunk's punches with it, worn off the paint and in general entertained many many people with it since buying for it for about $300 brand new. Is it worth $3K - nope, it's worth a hell of a lot more, but only to me.

 

[Caca de Kick]

I don't know what country you're in, but in the US it's not double in price between the 1st and 2nd halves of preEB. The gap is generally pretty close within a few hundred dollars. No one here is getting 3600 for a 79, they generally are 2100-2400 depending on the finish. A rare Inca that hasn't yellowed and is still beautiful might fetch in the upper 2's.
I do remember one sunburst/maple Ray from circa 82 selling here in the US for 3400 a few years ago, but it was because it was found still in dealer stock, never sold, and was mint-showroom as could be.
My sunburst 81 that was in stupid clean condition, I sold last year for 2200 and had buyers were stacked up in line. Again, condition is everything.

Strummer, there is nothing wrong with the 3-bolt on the vintage MM's, it was executed correctly as designed.
You're mixing the known issue with what CBS did poorly with Fenders and sloppy jigs/machinery...different company.