Tuning in Drop C

[Lythox]

Hello all, I'm having a really stressing problem with my guitar, and I dont know really where to post it, cause im not sure what it's related to.

I've been tuning my guitar in drop c for a while now, but my thickest string buzzes to the frets like hell if i keep the action a bit low. Only when I turn the action kinda high it goes away.. like 4-5 millimeter. I'm using beefy slinkys, but for the thickest string instead of a 54 I use a 58. I read about others using stuff like Skinny top heavy bottom for drop c. How is this possible if for me even a thick string like .58 buzzes so much..?

Also I don't know what action is average. I can't find anything on average action height on internet, I know its up to personal preference but guidelines would be useful to know if I'm not playing ridiculously high.

But worse. Open the thickest string is a perfect C, yet, the first fret on it is NOT a perfect Db, second fret no good either, etc etc. at the 12th fret the C is too sharp, meaning I have to adjust the saddle, yet the saddle is already all the way back.
It's also not the neck, that's straight and if it would be put straighter the strings would buzz even more making me have to put up the action even higher, making the string sound worse on 12th fret again because the distance to push gets bigger..

I brought it to the store and they adjusted it a bit. But all he did really was raise the bridge a bit, the buzz was sort of gone but the 12th fret was not better than before, it was still a bit too sharp.

I don't know how this is possible while i use such thick strings even, does anyone know what could be the problem? Maybe more normal strings like Skinny top Heavy bottom and tuning it to Eb or even standard E tuning will help?

(by the way i tried drop Db tuning as well, same problems, tho the action could go pretty much lower)

I use an ESP LTD ex-401 guitar.

thanks a lot in advance..

 

[Potatohead]

OK, I will try and go about this piece by piece.

First off, you are using good gauges for this tuning... Same thing as me really (I use a .019 string) and I have no issues, so that should not be the problem.

The thickest string will almost always buzz unless you have the action quite high. This is pretty normal. I personally get a little bit of buzz on the fifth string, too. If you cannot hear it through the amp it is not generally considered a big deal.

First, you have to make sure your neck relief is ok. Hold the sixth string down at the first fret, and the 17th fret. Look at the gap under it at the eighth fret, you should have just a tiny gap, about half the thickness of a credit card. If not, you may have to adjust the truss rod. Turn it clockwise to take bow out of the neck, and counter-clockwise to bow the neck more. Do not turn it more than 1/4 turn at a time, and turn it slowly.

Once you have the relief set, you can set action. I set my action at 1.3 mm on the sixth string, and 1.0 mm on the first string, measured from the bottom of the string to the 12th fret. Like I said this buzzes a bit and you may want it a bit higher, it is just preference. A more standard action would be about 1.6 and 1.3 mm.

Now, you can set intonation. No guitar intonates 100% right, so don't freak out over it. If you are having major intonation problems it may be because the action is very high, or there is too much neck bow. Set the intonation as good as you can at the twelfth fret. Sometimes using such a big string on the sixth string you will not be able to intonate perfectly because you cannot move the saddle back enough... Normal, and not much you can do about it without re-inventing the bridge.

Your guitar is pretty good, but chances are good the frets are not perfect. Again, nothing to worry about and unless buzzing drives you totally crazy, leave it. Otherwise you will have to dress the frets which is not really very cheap and something you generally do every few years or so.

You mention when you tune to Eb, the buzzing is less. Well, that makes perfect sense as the strings are more taught and do not move as much when you strum them, so they don't hit the frets as much. String gauge is personal as well, you may find you like thicker strings while some people do not. Some guys use a normal 10 - 52 set or something in C standard which to me feels like wet noodles.

 

[RocketRalf]

It could be one of, or a combination of a number of things: the neck being too straight, the nut being too high or the groove too small (the string not sitting in properly), the frets not level, etc. Honestly you won't get the right answer from an internet forum, only ideas of where to look, because we haven't seen your guitar. The above post is a good starting point though.

 

[Lythox]

Hi all again,

I've been reading the replies and I have to say it helped a lot, thanks very much for it. These guidelines will surely help me set my guitar proper and I think i'll stay to this string gauge, since it played pretty well in drop c, except for the buzzing part but yeah you don't really hear it through the amp.

One thing though, is that the 4th string, ( .22 F/G string) doesn't really fit too well in the nut, hence it is more lifted up than all the other strings.. I guess i have to just widen the nut at that string a little? (with a file or something? dunno if its the correct word for it)

Once again thanks very much!

 

[Lythox]

Once you have the relief set, you can set action. I set my action at 1.3 mm on the sixth string, and 1.0 mm on the first string, measured from the bottom of the string to the 12th fret. Like I said this buzzes a bit and you may want it a bit higher, it is just preference. A more standard action would be about 1.6 and 1.3 mm.

Auch, I just measured mine, its over 3 millimeter at the thickest string from 12th fret to the bottom of the string.. and still buzzes.. If i put it a bit lower the buzzing will increase pretty much too.

For the rest thanks a lot, your guidelines help, except the insane easy buzzing i have with this guitar T_T tho i have to say im a bit of a perfectionist so maybe i whine to easy over buzz tho my cheaper guitar is tuned in A# with like .52 strings instead of .58 and buzzes less..

 

[supadave]

Out of interest, what sort of stuff are you playing Lythox? I play a few QOTSA tunes with my band and, rather than mess mine up by expecting it to deal with being tuned up and down from such heights constantly, I had to get a stunt double for those songs, which I got set up to be permanently in C. I'm pretty sure 4 string basses hate being tuned that low but by god it sounds good!