Off Topic Black Clouds and Silver Linings

[edrod]

This is exactly what I was getting at, Ed. There are too many fans who aren't willing to accept change. I'm not saying you should AGREE with those changes, just that you should ACCEPT them. I could understand the bashing if the album was complete crap musically, but it very obviously isn't. The musicianship is just as outstanding as any other DT album and in some respects moreso.

My favorite DT album is still SFAM, but that doesn't mean I can't also like BC&SL.

And on another note. Could anyone else see The Count of Tuscany spawning another concept record?

Thanks man, I agree with everything you stated. Some people just need to move on if they don't like it. It's so easy to be a critic now a days. It's even easier to trash something we don't like. I am not referring to anyone in this forum. I have seen some crappy posts on other forums and youtube as well.

 

[Brand X]

I hope I don't offend anybody. It get's a little irritating hearing DT get bashed. There are fans that are stuck in the IAW era. Dream Theater has evolved musically, unfortunately some of their fans haven't.

It's like asking one of you guys to play the way you used to play 15 years ago, It is just ridiculous. As musicians progress, we get more ideas and influences. Take a look at your playing perhaps, I am sure it has evolve. This might be a "dumb" comparison but maybe some people can understand better.

Everybody says they are open minded but chances are most of them are not.

Dude - There's a chance you may be missing the point here. I wasn't DT bashing, I love this band and I'm certainly not stuck in the IAW era. As much as I love the band - that doesn't mean I don't have an opinion. My personal comparison to IAW was based upon lyrical content. I could have used SDOIT - same comparison. To me, some of the lyrics are a bit childish and beneath Dream Theater (to me), MP's vocals do grow tiresome (to me) and James (to me) should be given a longer leash to write his own lyrics etc....

To evolve is one thing - but to have lyrics that grow less mature as one gets more mature seems strange - just my opinion and certainly not bashing. I do find MP's ''Napalm Death'' vocal in Nightmare to be slightly cringeworthy - if that's a problem for you, then fine....'cause it just my opinion. I like to show other musicians how awesome DT are - but I can't play them that 'cause it's just wrong! LOL...DOes that mean I'm bashing, no...Does it mean I don't like them...no. Just because they are prob my favourite band - that doesn't mean I have to like everything that they do does it?

Incidentally, is it me or is the last 4 minutes at the end of Count of Tuscany just some of the most awesome music they've ever recorded? James vocals and delivery are just excellent and JP's sound awesome.....

 

[edrod]

Dude - There's a chance you may be missing the point here. I wasn't DT bashing, I love this band and I'm certainly not stuck in the IAW era. As much as I love the band - that doesn't mean I don't have an opinion. My personal comparison to IAW was based upon lyrical content. I could have used SDOIT - same comparison. To me, some of the lyrics are a bit childish and beneath Dream Theater (to me), MP's vocals do grow tiresome (to me) and James (to me) should be given a longer leash to write his own lyrics etc....

To evolve is one thing - but to have lyrics that grow less mature as one gets more mature seems strange - just my opinion and certainly not bashing. I do find MP's ''Napalm Death'' vocal in Nightmare to be slightly cringeworthy - if that's a problem for you, then fine....'cause it just my opinion. I like to show other musicians how awesome DT are - but I can't play them that 'cause it's just wrong! LOL...DOes that mean I'm bashing, no...Does it mean I don't like them...no. Just because they are prob my favourite band - that doesn't mean I have to like everything that they do does it?

Incidentally, is it me or is the last 4 minutes at the end of Count of Tuscany just some of the most awesome music they've ever recorded? James vocals and delivery are just excellent and JP's sound awesome.....

Sorry but read my last post

I am not referring to anyone in this forum.

 

[Brand X]

Sorry but read my last post

I am not referring to anyone in this forum.

Dude - I know....I was just making myself more clear as I don't want to be construed as a DT basher........

Cheers

 

[edrod]

Dude - I know....I was just making myself more clear as I don't want to be construed as a DT basher........

Cheers

You are quoting me and saying I am missing the point here. I never quoted you and pointed at you in any way. You are also saying that if that's a problem for me, then fine....'cause it just your opinion. Once again never did I quote you or acknowledge you in any form.

I specifically said that some comments in youtube and other forums seem ridiculous. I don't mind constructive criticism but to say a band sucks or there albums are not good (to their standards) because they are stuck in the IAW era can be deceiving. Noticed once again that I am not saying YOU.

If you need specific examples go to youtube. The comments there are not constructive criticism. I stated in my first post that this is something I like from this forum. They state their opinion but are smart and respectful about it. In my opinion you fall in this category and I don't consider you in any shape or form a DT basher.

MP is not too please about those type of comments either as you can see in the post that roburado made. I think I know how he might feel. It's almost like your significant other is telling you that they wished you were like their ex every time you attempt to do anything for them. Again, dumb comparison but it might help to get my point across, well maybe.

 

[bkrumme]

I don't think anyone here has "bashed" DT in any way. It's just frustrating sometimes because as fans we take our favorite artists very seriously. There are times when I feel the need to defend them though it may not be necessary.

And let's remember that you can't read a mood or any kind of tone in text. We read things and interpret them how we want. There could just be some big misunderstanding due to perception.

To me, making a comparison to an older album by the same artist is unfair in the first place. There are factors which we may never even know about that affect the songwriting and recording process. Add those to the years of change between albums and you've got a recipe for opinionated "bashing" of the material. This is why I tend to use a scale of favorites instead of comparing albums directly. This just seems like a more constructive way to approach a new record. Plus, I love everything DT does.

And I actually have an answer to a question Brand X asked in an earlier post: No I don't think they've taken a step back with their songwriting, just a different approach. I think this is an affect of wisdom on their parts. There's no need to be symbolic when you can just tell it how it is...if you know what I mean. I can understand, however, how it would seem like a step back to some. It's very different from earlier albums.

 

[ScoobySteve]

I think we all need to listen to some Lady Gaga tunes for a bit and come back and show some love and appreciation for DT. Yeah?

 

[leftyguitarblue]

I think we all need to listen to some Lady Gaga tunes for a bit and come back and show some love and appreciation for DT. Yeah?

Lady Gaga? Wow, my ears just threw up just thinking about that.

 

[Dante]

I think we all need to listen to some Lady Gaga tunes for a bit and come back and show some love and appreciation for DT. Yeah?

dude, please, i just came back from work ok?

 

[bkrumme]

I think we all need to listen to some Lady Gaga tunes for a bit and come back and show some love and appreciation for DT. Yeah?

I think I just threw up a little.

 

[ProtoChicken]

So are you guys saying you feel Lady Gaga's new material has taken a step back when compared to Images And Words?

 

[bkrumme]

So are you guys saying you feel Lady Gaga's new material has taken a step back when compared to Images And Words?

I think I just puked some more.

My opinion of Lady Gag-me-with-a-spoon would be unfit for any to read on this forum.

 

[ProtoChicken]

I think I just puked some more.

My opinion of Lady Gag-me-with-a-spoon would be unfit for any to read on this forum.

You're just mad you didn't come up with the name Lady Gaga first.

Back on topic. I love this album more with every listen. I really hope they play TCOT on the Progressive Nation tour, or at least on the 2nd US leg in the spring.

 

[MikeVt]

Now that I've listened to BC&SL about 20 times, I'm totally hooked. This one is definitely among my favorites. I too think IAW was one of their best albums, but with very few exceptions, I've loved every album since - even though they are all different. Every once in a while DT hits a sour note for me - namely Awake and Systematic Chaos. However, if you think about it, that's an AMAZING hit rate for any band. How many times have you bought an album for a song or two that you liked and ended up deleting most of the others when you put it on your ipod? On most of DTs albums, I love EVERY song. I don't think I could ask for any better.

Just some unsolicited comments.
Mike

 

[leftyguitarblue]

So are you guys saying you feel Lady Gaga's new material has taken a step back when compared to Images And Words?

They have collaborated. I think she sang The Glass Prison in Germany

 

[Bassey]

They have collaborated. I think she sang The Glass Prison in Germany

Lol!

No you got it wrong. It was Caught in a web And it's actually not Lady Gaga but Jordan Rudess with a wig. Didn't you notice the Zen Riffer in his hands?

Great show though! (I was there! But I have to admit that I liked Neal Morse better than DT)

On topic: The album is growing on me more and more. Personal highlights are the "In peaceful sedation" part of A nightmare to remember (almost "scenes from a memory" like harmonies. Wither is nice and the outro of TCOT

 

[kissmyaxe]

I do not think this album is bad but I dont think it's completley done growing on me. I dont think it willl ever be an album I can listen to for weeks on end like Octavarium, SC, Tot and SFaM. I have a feeling its going to rate 5 or 6th on my favorite DT albums. Wither has to be their worst song written this decade though, just my opinion

 

[MikeVt]

Wither has to be their worst song written this decade though, just my opinion

Why? Because it's not progressive enough? I happen to like it.

Mike

 

[Paul in WV]

Wither has to be their worst song written this decade though, just my opinion

I personally absolutely LOVE "Wither". I have no reason for this other than it might, one day, get them on the Ra-Didio (and that may or may not matter to them at all).

Radio play is one way to get a few new fans though I do tend to think it's influence is waning every day.

And...

"The County of Tuscany" is playing (again) right now!

 

[patpark]

i downloaded it last night from iTunes and love it. Great playing and dig the tones. I hear tinges of black metal here and there. Its epic and I love it.