Cutting trough issue

[dasneboja]

My MM StingRay's D and G strings are not cutting trough
as good as my Precision Special '81.
When I play alone, everything sounds perfect, but
with a band I just lack volume on those strings...
I've used different amps(GK, SWR) and cabinets(4x12,2x10,1x15),
but results are same...

Am I the only one having this issue?

I've searched this and couple more forums,
but found nothing about it...

 

[danny-79]

PU hight maby ? have a read through this :

http://www.music-man.com/faq/music-man-basses/how-do-i-set-up-my-music-man-bass.html

 

[kylierider]

I had the same problem with both of mine. Just raise the G side of the pickup up. Problem solved

 

[keko]

I had the same problem with both of mine. Just raise the G side of the pickup up. Problem solved

OK, that's for sure, but pretty important is also to respect factory strings gauge and second thing is how You setup preamp tone controls too!

 

[sitonmybass]

Play harder on the D and G strings.

 

[oli@bass]

[...] pretty important is [...] how You setup preamp tone controls too!

No. Why does this sort of completely false information always come up in these "my G string is weak" threads?!

No preamp or EQ is able to affect all the notes on single string without affecting notes on other strings. It's either the pickup height, the string heigth, the string gauge, your picking strength, or all of them together.

 

[agplate]

It's a quirk of most Stingrays. Search again and you'll find tons of discussion about it. Part of the charm I guess. I'll bet its between the 5th and 9th fret too! Mostly, we just get used to it or buy Bongos!

Thats all.

 

[keko]

No. Why does this sort of completely false information always come up in these "my G string is weak" threads?!

No preamp or EQ is able to affect all the notes on single string without affecting notes on other strings. It's either the pickup height, the string heigth, the string gauge, your picking strength, or all of them together.

I must disagree my friend, 'cause I have experienced such a problems when I was working live gigs as a soundman. Lots of bass players with "crazy" setup of bass preamp and amp's preamp was having similar problems. Than I said, OK just give me a try to play Your bass for a minute..., than set all flat and start from beginning on my way, give it back to the bass player..., and in 90% reaction was... wooow, that's my bass?
Unfortunately there were 10% of them who said, come on man give me a break, I like it this way, ...I said OK, Your problem, but I'll cut You through the mix of the PA system on my way anyway!

But I do agree that basic bass setup is definitely most important at the first place, properly strings gauge, strings height, pickup height...truss rod setup...etc.

 

[oli@bass]

I'll bet its between the 5th and 9th fret too!

That would be a dead spot. Completely different animal than a weak string.

I must disagree my friend, 'cause I have experienced such a problems when I was working live gigs as a soundman.

I'm sorry keko, but I've seen so many of these threads filled with good intentioned tips spreading false information. And believe me, I've had my share of basses with weak strings, dead spots and wolf tones. They are a physical phenomenon grounded in the combination of materials and construction of the instrument which cannot be compensated for by electronic equalisation. And these are all different problems, which often get mixed up because musicians have not the slightest clue about physics.

Cures:

A weak string (all notes on a particular string are less loud than corresponding notes on other strings -- a phenomenon connected to the vibrating mass of the string and the magnetic field of the pickup):

1. Adjust your playing to pluck the thinner string a bit harder
2. Adjust pickup in order to move the pole pieces closer to the weak string, or move the pole pieces of the other strings away from them. Sometimes, it is sufficient to move the pickup for all the strings to get a more even response, simply because a strong magentic field can have an adverse effect on string vibration.
3. Use a heavier gauge for the thinner strings

-- there is no way that equalisation can help to compensate all notes on a single string, but not affect the same notes on other strings!

A dead spot or wolf tone (a single note on a single string being less loud or lacking sustain, or being much louder and ringing than all other notes -- a phenomenon connected to the resonance frequency patterns of the neck):

1. Don't play that note (yeah, I know that sucks!)
2. Add mass to the head stock which will change the resonance frequency of the neck and thus eleminate or change the position of the dead/wolf spot.
3. Get a fret levelling and proper set up done by a good luthier -- I have a fretless that had an immensely bad dead spot on the 7th fret G string position (the ususal suspect) which is almost gone since the fretboard was levelled and the whole bass properly set up.

-- there is no way that equalisation can help to compensate a single note on a single string, but not affect the same note on other strings!


I hope this helps a bit to clear up the myths.

 

[keko]

OK, oli, You really did a good hard work trying to explain this matter and You have my respect for that, but don't need to Quote mine posts just in small context, 'cause it looks like we are totally opposite, but we are not, ...in 90% I see we understand each other, there was just one disagree matter according this abnormally preamp settings issue, right?

Peace!

Edit: ...I hope that starter of this Thread did collect enough informations about his/hers problem!

 

[Powman]

Looks like a war between Switzerland and Croatia has been averted. All is well in Europe again? (Except for Greece).

 

[keko]

Looks like a war between Switzerland and Croatia has been averted. All is well in Europe again? (Except for Greece).

No thanks, make peace not war!

I'm always for negotiations, so I'll rise the white flag first!

 

[MadMatt]

What I learned from this thread is I need Keko to be our soundman for the next gig and Oli@Bass needs to come to Frankfurt and set up my Bass

 

[oli@bass]

Looks like a war between Switzerland and Croatia has been averted. All is well in Europe again? (Except for Greece).

Quite the exaggeration!

No thanks, make peace not war!

I'm always for negotiations, so I'll rise the white flag first!

I'm also into peace. And I don't even see a need for a white flag.

What I learned from this thread is I need Keko to be our soundman for the next gig and Oli@Bass needs to come to Frankfurt and set up my Bass

That could actually be fun but although I do small adjustments myself, I do bring my basses to a fine luthier in the next village to do the real wonders.

 

[dmk]

No weak anything on my new four string Classic. All strings are balanced, and no dead spot anywhere that I can find - and I really looked. Had the weak G and dead spot on my 30th Anniversary and five string non-Classic. Every bass I've owned Custom Shop Precision, Sadowsky, Carvin etc had dead spots.

Guess what? My Classic is a definite keeper. Problem is, it's so good that I want one in every color.

 

[Jim C]

Only bass I've ever owned with virtualy no dead spot was a very early Steinberger.
I think that the Ray G string volume can be sound overstated bt EQ.
Last night's gig had us on a stage with a plate glass window as a backdrop.
During the first set the G string sounded quiet / wimpier than the others.
Backed off the upper mids on a LMII and things were better.
For the 2nd set I angled the TL606 cabinet (2" foam block) and some further EQ refinement and all is just right.

Could be that the OP's issued is not absolute string volume but rather perceived volume based on EQ or dispersion characteristics of the cabinet.

BTW, ain't nothin perfect in this world; no reason to think that his bass (and others) could have an issue or two.

There might be what seems like a huge number of posts about G string volume but it's insignificant compared to how many basses sold.

 

[dasneboja]

@Keko

Yep, definitely... this discussion is more than useful for me...

best part is about preamp affect on string volume,
in theory, I disagree with that, but in real life it can be helpful...

most of the time I am using flat preamp,
lately I even cut bass on half (-1,5dB)
and results are pretty good, nice and clear sound...

all other suggestions are something that we all agree
(right string gauge,PA height and neck relief)

so, tnx guys...

 

[orpheus55]

I had heard about this issue long before I owned a Ray; it actually kept me away from them. However, my 4 string Stingray H has never had this issue, and I pretty much played it straight out of the box. Unlike my Fender Js, there are no dead spots, and the attack is formidable on all strings at all times.

 

[1kinal]

I also heard of this issue long before I owned a 'Ray. I think it is a fact that stingrays are more prone to this problem than other basses. It is also part of his charm but I do think it can be changed to at least be tolerable.

Pickup height do a big part on that. Might also want to try a little relief on the neck so the string can have a larger axis to vibrate.

But really, "using the factory string guage"? No. Completely false info. A bass is made to be used with any string guage as long as it can pass thru the bridge. That said, you do have to adjust string height at the bridge, intonation and neck relief after changing string guages. String guage is a personnal preference.

With all due respect, it always amaze me when I read stuff like "EBMM instruments comes perfect from the factory, don't change anything on them (strings brand, strings guage, setup, etc). I wonder if on the Honda forum you see stuff like "Your seat position comes perfect from the factory, don't change it". Nobody has the same fit, nobody plays bass the same way.

 

[mmbassplayer]

I wonder if on the Honda forum you see stuff like "Your seat position comes perfect from the factory, don't change it".

My Honda was actually setup quite to my liking when i purchaced a Civic in 2007! It didn't have a single deadspot. JOSH