I dunno about all this, but in my mind the jpxi would supercede some of the others due to the stainless frets. I guess it's a personal preference, but a guitar that wears less has greater value. I'm not sure of the demand, but sure would love to see the stallion continue with the stainless... It would be interesting to know whether jp's a big fan of the stainless. I believe jpxi is the only jp model with them
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Adrian-XI
Well-known member
They are shiney 
Lax
Well-known member
Starting from the high quality all JP have, oneself may totally buy a BFR because of the color, a JPX for the chambering or an older for unfinished neck.
Every model has pros and cons, we cannot buy a bfr body with great color and an unfinished neck with steel frets :s
I respectfully stay on my position, the stallion will maybe be the ultimate guitar for JP, but not for fellow guitar players, except if there are options and choices.
Every model has pros and cons, we cannot buy a bfr body with great color and an unfinished neck with steel frets :s
I respectfully stay on my position, the stallion will maybe be the ultimate guitar for JP, but not for fellow guitar players, except if there are options and choices.
BrickGlass
Well-known member
That is why I have so much admiration for the EB/MM company. You really do put the artist first. These great players like Luke, JP, Steve Morse and Albert Lee just get exactly what they want, whatever it is. You guys just happen to make cool enough guitars that other people want them too. And you can tell whenever you hear those artists talking about their signature guitars that they absolutely love them and love EB/MM for making them.
brokenvail
Well-known member
The answer to this is easy enough. I one months time will be namm abd there we will see the JPXII and maybe the stallion. if they SS frets are there that means he still digs them (at least for now) I find it a little funny that you said the JPXI is the ultimate because of the SS frets. I say this because BP always says he makes tools for artists so there is a chance JP can say he doesn't like them or want then on the next model and bam it is gone and to many the next one will be the ultimate.
Big Poppa
Well-known member
jp likes and uses all of tyhem he is on a journey...because he tries something different is not denegrating the previous efforts. Sort of like cds.....
Nah I didn't say it was the ultimate... I just said that a guitar that wears less would be better in my mind. More of a personal preference. I never knew all the jp models have different radii and fret size as someone stated earlier... This is pretty cool for the consumer even though I imagine it's probably hard to determine the demand for each specific model. Maybe it's not as demand specific as I think it is, but moreover general demand for the jp product. It's crazy to think you could walk into a store and pickup a jpx jpxi jp jp bfr and get different feel out of each guitar.
Big Poppa
Well-known member
BFR I believe that planned obsolescence is sort of harsh.... It implies collusion and intent to harm financially. we still offer each one that he has designed with us. Is it planned obsolescence or trying to progress? The tools that JP gets in his head dont subtract from the choices...they add.
DrKev
Moderator
Wow, I didn't think of that. Ever JP model is still being made. It must be a headache for somebody to fit yet another model into the production line!
Break out the shoe horn! JP had another idea!
Break out the shoe horn! JP had another idea!
beej
Moderator
I think being able to work so closely with artists like JP to truly make what they need (as opposed to the typical "artist models", customized with cosmetics you often see) is amazing.
But man, it must mess with collectors.
But man, it must mess with collectors.
Planned Obsolescence is legitimate strategy in modern economy even though the term is pretty old and it dates back to 1930's. I will cite the Wikipedia:
Planned style obsolescence occurs when marketers change the styling of products so customers will purchase products more frequently. The style changes are designed to make owners of the old model feel "out of date". It is also designed to differentiate the product from the competition, thereby reducing price competition. One example of style obsolescence is the automobile industry, in which manufacturers typically make style changes every year or two. As the former CEO of General Motors, Alfred P. Sloan stated in 1941, "Today the appearance of a motorcar is a most important factor in the selling end of the business—perhaps the most important factor— because everyone knows the car will run."
If I was an artist with the signature line of course I would like to explore new things and experiment but i would also like to enjoy in all those improvements for the longer period of time. The change isn't purpose for itself but for making my life easier.
Planned style obsolescence occurs when marketers change the styling of products so customers will purchase products more frequently. The style changes are designed to make owners of the old model feel "out of date". It is also designed to differentiate the product from the competition, thereby reducing price competition. One example of style obsolescence is the automobile industry, in which manufacturers typically make style changes every year or two. As the former CEO of General Motors, Alfred P. Sloan stated in 1941, "Today the appearance of a motorcar is a most important factor in the selling end of the business—perhaps the most important factor— because everyone knows the car will run."
If I was an artist with the signature line of course I would like to explore new things and experiment but i would also like to enjoy in all those improvements for the longer period of time. The change isn't purpose for itself but for making my life easier.
Jimmyb
Well-known member
So when does the Strat get its planned obsolescence?
Seriously, I don't think it holds true in the world of the guitar (or amplifiers for that matter). Look at the classic designs, they're still as valid now as they were 50 or so years ago. Even effects pedals are still (to a large extent) based on circuitry from the '60's (like the Big Muff, Fuzz face etc)
Seriously, I don't think it holds true in the world of the guitar (or amplifiers for that matter). Look at the classic designs, they're still as valid now as they were 50 or so years ago. Even effects pedals are still (to a large extent) based on circuitry from the '60's (like the Big Muff, Fuzz face etc)
brokenvail
Well-known member
Normally I would agree but the amount of hours JP spends playing per year is pretty crazy. As a result he spends a bunch of time with his guitars. I think the JPX was a true experiment trying to apply some of what was learned via the 25th anniversary. The JPX was a step back toward the "normal" BFR model in that it had a 3 way no chambers. I am interested to see what the JPXII will be like. I also think that demand for all models continues to remain high so Eb continues making them all. I mean how many others guys have had various versions of their sig models get discountinued. These sticking around shows that there is a JP model for everyone
beej
Moderator
BFR, in the automotive example you cite, earlier models are no longer available when new ones are introduced. Here every JP guitar is still available.
If you're suggesting MM just wants people to give up the old guitars and buy new ones, certainly they would have taken the old ones off the market, not kept selling them.
Besides, it's a silly thing to suggest. If you look at MM's history, they don't introduce "old guitar with new shiny thing" every year like many manufacturers do. Most of the models haven't changed in many years.
And how long should they wait before giving an artist what they ask for? Doing it on a set schedule, not when there's an inspiration to build something new, would look more like a cash grab. This is exactly the opposite. They're giving the artist a chance to have something new and innovative. And the bonus is that it's not a one-off that only he gets, they're making it available to everybody.
If you're suggesting MM just wants people to give up the old guitars and buy new ones, certainly they would have taken the old ones off the market, not kept selling them.
Besides, it's a silly thing to suggest. If you look at MM's history, they don't introduce "old guitar with new shiny thing" every year like many manufacturers do. Most of the models haven't changed in many years.
And how long should they wait before giving an artist what they ask for? Doing it on a set schedule, not when there's an inspiration to build something new, would look more like a cash grab. This is exactly the opposite. They're giving the artist a chance to have something new and innovative. And the bonus is that it's not a one-off that only he gets, they're making it available to everybody.
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I'm not talking about the MM's history, I'm talking about the last couple of years. How many new JP models have appeared? As far as I concerned, Petrucci BFR is "the ultimate guitar", the perfect model (besides my little problem with tuning stability).
When first JP model hit the street I felt it lacked of aesthetics in sense of body color and finish. BFR model fixed everything for me because I'm a fan of quilted tops. I had everything I want, excellent wood, beautiful finish and great sound. What else do we need?
I understand that somebody else might prefer something different like, unfinished maple neck, or some other combination of pickups or colors but that's the job for custom shop.
We can take other examples in amps market that somebody mentioned. What's the best Marshall amp model in your opinion? My choices would be Plexi and JCM 800. Can we buy them today? Or we can take another great brand, Mesa Boogie. Do we really need Mark V with IIC+ channel? I would rather have original IIC+.
The same method we had with Petrucci's Ibanez era. Every new model brought just another combination of colors, and maybe different pickups but that's all.
beej
Moderator
That might be true about Ibanez, but with MM you're seeing a lot of change with each new model, not just cosmetics. Different woods, necks, chambered body, etc. At a bigger manufacturer, this might be a job for a custom shop. But MM is still a small company- given their size and philosophy towards building and innovation, there's no room for a custom shop.
As for "what else do we need?", that's not the question. It's "what else does JP need?", and so John & MM continue to prototype and experiment. It may stop tomorrow, it may never stop.
Let's say MM didn't make the guitar available to anyone but JP. This place would be full of "please Sterling, let me buy it!" threads. So isn't it better to make it available to everyone right off the bat? It's more choices, not less.
Choice is good!
As for "what else do we need?", that's not the question. It's "what else does JP need?", and so John & MM continue to prototype and experiment. It may stop tomorrow, it may never stop.
Let's say MM didn't make the guitar available to anyone but JP. This place would be full of "please Sterling, let me buy it!" threads. So isn't it better to make it available to everyone right off the bat? It's more choices, not less.
Choice is good!
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