500k or 250k tone pot?

[AxSport4me]

I just got my guitar back from getting new pots and the speed knobs installed. My guitar tech who is very well respected in my area suggested 250k tone pot will be better then the 500k which come stock with EBMMs. Who am i to argue with him so i said do whatever you feel is right! Well.....he put the 250k for the tone and it sounds great!!!! Still have 500k for volume and now 250k for tone. Anybody else come across this situation before?

 

[Jimi D]

I think the rule of thumb is a 250k for Single Coils and 500k for humbuckers, but I know guys who've dropped 1Meg pots in their Les Pauls and think it's the shyte. I personally prefer the 500k pots on both my humbucker and single-coil -equipped EBMMs, but to each their own. If it sounds good to you, do it...

 

[beej]

Pot values do two things- affect the load on the pickups and affect the range of the controls.

The pickups will see the combined load/resistance of the pots. The higher the load, the brighter the output and vice versa. (This is why most humbuckers use 500k pots while single coils use 250k pots- in general humbuckers are less bright than single coils.)

So what you've done is to lower the overall load applied to the pickups, thus darkening them slightly. Probably get more mids that way. The other effect is that the range of your tone pot will also have shifted.

I say if it feels good ... do it

 

[AxSport4me]

I think the rule of thumb is a 250k for Single Coils and 500k for humbuckers, but I know guys who've dropped 1Meg pots in their Les Pauls and think it's the shyte. I personally prefer the 500k pots on both my humbucker and single-coil -equipped EBMMs, but to each their own. If it sounds good to you, do it...

Well its already a done deal and it sounds great!!! I have MM90 pickups on my Sport but i dont know the reasons why he felt the 250k pot are better for the tone. He kept the 500k for volume and switched to 250k for tone. Has anyone ever did this????? 500k volume......250k tone?????????

 

[Orpheus]

500k or 250k?

Man I just bought a Silho HSH and it sounds great BUT.. I don't know if its the Pot or the Humbuckers, It feel like something is holding back the output. If I use distortion, I think It sound like a single coil and you guys know that they don't have the same output.. my Silho came with 250k and I'm about to change it but not sure. Or it's the humbucker? They say they are Paf Pro but they don't sound like Paf Pro. Do you think if I put a 500k will work for me? or it's just the pickup?

 

[( o )===#]

Sorry to jack the thread, but what's the difference?

 

[TNT]

Yeah,

I personally think the "tone" pot is overlooked most of the time, but is such an important link in the tone chain!!

 

[whitestrat]

Man I just bought a Silho HSH and it sounds great BUT.. I don't know if its the Pot or the Humbuckers, It feel like something is holding back the output. If I use distortion, I think It sound like a single coil and you guys know that they don't have the same output.. my Silho came with 250k and I'm about to change it but not sure. Or it's the humbucker? They say they are Paf Pro but they don't sound like Paf Pro. Do you think if I put a 500k will work for me? or it's just the pickup?

If your Silo was brand new, it's not PAF Pro. It's a set of Virtual PAFs.

But why do you say it sounds like a single coil? Can you post clips? There are 3 possible reasons, I think:

1. You're not used to the lower output of the virtual PAFs, which has some spank to the tone unlike most high gain pups.
2. The neck pickup is not at the usual 24th frets harmonic position, and may sound thinner, when compared to say, an LP or an Axis.
3. There's something wrong with the wiring. This happenned on one of my 20ths, and the humbucker was effectively a single coil.

I don't know which it is, unless you can post some clips.

 

[whitestrat]

Well its already a done deal and it sounds great!!! I have MM90 pickups on my Sport but i dont know the reasons why he felt the 250k pot are better for the tone. He kept the 500k for volume and switched to 250k for tone. Has anyone ever did this????? 500k volume......250k tone?????????

MM90s? Yes, I'd say 250k sounds good... On humbuckers, especially low output ones, 250 would be really nice too, but it's an acquired taste. Some like it, some say it's not enough.

 

[Orpheus]

If your Silo was brand new, it's not PAF Pro. It's a set of Virtual PAFs.

But why do you say it sounds like a single coil? Can you post clips? There are 3 possible reasons, I think:

1. You're not used to the lower output of the virtual PAFs, which has some spank to the tone unlike most high gain pups.
2. The neck pickup is not at the usual 24th frets harmonic position, and may sound thinner, when compared to say, an LP or an Axis.
3. There's something wrong with the wiring. This happenned on one of my 20ths, and the humbucker was effectively a single coil.

I don't know which it is, unless you can post some clips.

Definitely It was the PUs. I just changed them for a pair of Pearly Gates that I have, and now this guitar is alive, but should I changed the potentiometer...well hehe I already bought it (500k) should I change the capacitor too? and also the D-Sonic is on its way for the bridge position. I'm sorry guys, you guys might say I'm crazy, just tow days with a new Silho and already a Pickup change!! Well I like this guitar but I'm very picky with my sound. And Silho is going to be versatil for me. What I'm trying reach is a guitar with a heavy sound on the bridge and a Bluesy sound on the neck, and beside that this guitar is 5 positions so I have more versatility. I love steve ray sound but love Petrucci's heavy sound too. And Duhhh I know I'm not going to get either cuz It's not a stra, I'm not steve, it's not petrucci's guitar. Yeah I know all that. I'm just looking for something similar.

-And can someone tell me how to stop the hum on this guitar. I don't know why I get a lot of hum, even from the humbuckers.

 

[whitestrat]

-And can someone tell me how to stop the hum on this guitar. I don't know why I get a lot of hum, even from the humbuckers.

This is exactly what I was talking about as number 3 in my list. When the coils are wired wrong, and only one coil is active, then there's tons of hum, and your humbucker is essentially a single coil.

 

[Orpheus]

This is exactly what I was talking about as number 3 in my list. When the coils are wired wrong, and only one coil is active, then there's tons of hum, and your humbucker is essentially a single coil.

But why is this. I mean I would they do such thing? Or It's just a mistake? I got the Hum even with the SD installed!!

 

[beej]

If you're getting a lot of hum and you're sure it's not your amp, cable, etc. (try other guitars/other amps to rule a problem in your signal chain), then you probably have a wiring problem.

There could be several reasons why. It could be improperly grounded, you could have the coils wired up wrong, etc.

You might be able to get some free advice if you can take a good picture of the wiring. But I'd suggest sitting down with a multimeter and a wiring diagram and double checking everything. If you're not comfortable with that, take it to a tech. Don't forget that SDs colour codes are different than Dimarzios.

 

[whitestrat]

But why is this. I mean I would they do such thing? Or It's just a mistake? I got the Hum even with the SD installed!!

probably an accident.

 

[uvacom]

Pot values do two things- affect the load on the pickups and affect the range of the controls.

The pickups will see the combined load/resistance of the pots. The higher the load, the brighter the output and vice versa. (This is why most humbuckers use 500k pots while single coils use 250k pots- in general humbuckers are less bright than single coils.)

So what you've done is to lower the overall load applied to the pickups, thus darkening them slightly. Probably get more mids that way. The other effect is that the range of your tone pot will also have shifted.

I say if it feels good ... do it

To add to this a little, the type of "brightness" that potentiometers affect is the resonant peak of the pickup. The lower the pot value, the less "peaky" the output signal will be. We guitarists tend to like to classify everything that affects the higher-frequency range as "brightness", but there is a big difference between raising the peak frequency and raising the peak amplitude. Also, the type of range shift you will see is mainly when the pots are all the way up.

I've created a couple diagrams using a handy PSPICE simulation to show what the difference in response looks like - The first one is a simple sweep of the tone pot value, from 100k (bottom line) to 1Meg (top line).

The second one is a sweep of the volume pot (also 100k-1Meg) - the difference is very similar (though not as pronounced), and I've zoomed in on the peak section and labeled the peak frequency and corresponding amplitude so you can see that both the peak frequency and amplitude shift by quite a bit.