how do YOU spell relief?

[Musiksketcher]

Ok, i know the relief/action topics are beat to death..but i have a ponder; how many of you actually measure your setup as apposed to just guessing by feel? do you prefer the string height at the last fret higher than the 12th, or even,or lower, or somewhere in between..etc? what settings do you find the best tone, what settings find the best speed (clean). this is not a poll, i'm just curious what other players prefer. I personally find 3/32 of height at 12th and last frets offers best tone and only feels slightly high. it also offers best string "feel" ( tension). one more thing..if you do measure your setup..do you use the top of the measure line?..bottom? yeah it's a picky thing but i'm curious. thanks for participating.

 

[mynan]

I personally find 3/32 of height at 12th and last frets offers best tone and only feels slightly high. it also offers best string "feel" ( tension).

You'll have to explain this to me. I seriously doubt that fretboard action affects tone and I know for a fact that it has nothing to do with string tension...unless, of course, you forget to retune after making adjustments.

 

[Musiksketcher]

to clarify.. i find at higher fretboard action basses tend to "sing" better..at lower action they tend to have a slightly thinner sound. imo. regarding string tension, i find certain settings make the strings tension feel more firm, and other settings add more flexibility. perhaps it's symantics, but these are my findings over 30 yrs and as many basses. i just have little opportunity to queery other bassists on their findings. thanks for your reply.

 

[mynan]

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful. I understand what you are saying...it just goes against physics.

I usually adjust the action to get it as low as I can without getting fret buzz using my playing style. Then I adjust the intonation and set the pickup height to factory specs. I use the pickup as a thumbrest, so with the pickup adjusted to factory specs it feels the same to my right hand no matter where the action is set. It should also make my tone the same no matter where the action is set.

 

[Musiksketcher]

thanks..and thats exactlly why i posted..to get other players views! keep em coming, surely i'm not the only one who is curious.

 

[iamcatwarrior]

I use the Music Man bass setup guide every time I need to make an adjustment. The setup conditions specified therein, particularly 12th-fret string height, are very good for my style of playing.

Most of the time, I just have to adjust the truss rod a little bit in either direction to get the right string height. If I get 3/32 - 1/8", that works great. I have very seldom had to adjust saddle height to achieve this.

 

[five7]

I don't know how many ch's high my strings are, but my stingray feels lower than sin compared to any other bass I have played in 35 years. The truss rod is right on the money with just a bit of rise at the nut. And all this after I rescued it from someone who had put big strings on it and let it have a healthy bow. Took it home, cut off those old strings, cleaned it, put on some 40-100s, adjusted the truss rod, lowered the action, set the intonation, cleaned it again, tuned it up one more time, turned on my svt and played licks I haven't played before. Instant love! Lower than sin action and harmonics that will ring for days! I am sold on Ernie Ball!

 

[oli@bass]

I never measured, but always set the action as low as possible by feel and ear. Not very scientific, and thus not very helpful I guess. I like to have rather low action and those bassist who took my basses into their hands were amazed about the feel. However, I know two fine luthiers who have done absolutely amazing setups on my StingRays, their work including fret or fingerboard levelling and filing the nut to get as low as possible without buzz.


Forgot to mention: I set up the relief with a very slight bow so that when holding the string down on the first and last fret, the string is just not lying flat on the frets at the 9th fret.

 

[maddog]

Sorry I couldn't be more helpful. I understand what you are saying...it just goes against physics.

On open strings, sure. On fretted, it doesn't.

By Hooke's law (F = -k*x, where F is force, k is some constant, and x is the displacement from rest) if the action is higher, it raises the tension of the string more when fretting. Higher action requires larger displacement to fret which increases the overall force in the system. Simply put, it is harder to fret. Also affects the intonation. Think in terms of drawing a long or recurve bow.

Oh T-bone, let me know how excited J-bone gets when reading this.

Also, in the original post, the poster doesn't mention adjustng pickup height. This could be causing the difference in tone he is hearing. Just a guess at this point. Or the fact that he is trying to get even action up and down fretboard giving an equal displacement on each fret when fretted.

 

[Musiksketcher]

thanks for the replies..keep them coming..more input!!..lol regarding saddle adjustments...i keep the saddles pretty much where EB set them, yet i do fine tune a little for comfort. i prefer to feel consistant action thru length of neck..i dont like it really low at 3rd fret and really high at 14th etc.. so some saddlework is required.
please keep posting..the more comments the better. it's great to hear what others find to be a comfy setup and why.

 

[T-bone]

Oh T-bone, let me know how excited J-bone gets when reading this.

Dayem, you were reading my mind.

I'll make sure she sees this.

tbone

 

[Aussie Mark]

Ok, i know the relief/action topics are beat to death..but i have a ponder; how many of you actually measure your setup as apposed to just guessing by feel?

I go by feel, my aim for setup is as low as possible without buzzing. I have no idea how my action compares to the FAQ.

 

[maddog]

I have a feeling your action is HAWT!

 

[Kirby]

I go for 2/32 or just over at the 12th with just a hair of relief in the neck. If I can slide a thin scale pick between the strings and the frets when checking relief it is good for me. I tend to play very light though and use a floating thumb technique for speed so I do not get buzz. If you play more aggresively, this may not work for you.

 

[strummer]

I use the factory bridge heights, but decrese the relief just a little from factory specs. And with that simpe adjustment there's no need to measure...

 

[phat5]

I set my relief @ a business cards thickness...........only with flats! I have a lite touch, so I can get by with without any buzzing

 

[leond]

On my fretted SR4, I set the neck with the slightest amount of relief and lower the saddles until the strings just rattle on the lower frets with my normal playing style. Then I raise the saddles to just where the rattling stops.

On my fretless Bongo 4, set the neck with no relief and lower the saddles till I get the amount of "mwah" that I want.


Regarding tone and string height, I think they are definitely related. Rumor has it that James Jamerson had tone to die for with his P bass. The action was so high that mere mortals could hardly play the bass. I also believe Stevie Ray Vaughn, in addition to using very heavy strings, also played with very high action.

String height is an easy discussion however. Just raise your strings (at the bridge) on your bass and see if you have better tone. You may or may not.

Obviously, even if the tone gets better, as you raise you action, the playability will suffer. Like in life, playability vs. tone is a tradeoff. Chances are MusicMan's recommendations are a good compromise and certainly the best place to start.

LeonD

 

[mynan]

On open strings, sure. On fretted, it doesn't.

By Hooke's law (F = -k*x, where F is force, k is some constant, and x is the displacement from rest) if the action is higher, it raises the tension of the string more when fretting. Higher action requires larger displacement to fret which increases the overall force in the system. Simply put, it is harder to fret. Also affects the intonation. Think in terms of drawing a long or recurve bow.

True...and applicable if we were talking about a difference in action of 1/4 inch or more, but we're talking about 32nds of an inch at the 12th fret. If you are feeling the affects of Hooke's law, it's called neglect, not high action.

 

[maddog]

True...and applicable if we were talking about a difference in action of 1/4 inch or more, but we're talking about 32nds of an inch at the 12th fret. If you are feeling the affects of Hooke's law, it's called neglect, not high action.

Where does 1/4" come from?

Care to share your computations?

 

[ggunn]

On open strings, sure. On fretted, it doesn't.

By Hooke's law (F = -k*x, where F is force, k is some constant, and x is the displacement from rest) if the action is higher, it raises the tension of the string more when fretting. Higher action requires larger displacement to fret which increases the overall force in the system. Simply put, it is harder to fret. Also affects the intonation. Think in terms of drawing a long or recurve bow.

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing... ;^)

If your action is high enough to noticeably increase the tension in the string when you fret a note, then you'll notice the note going sharp a lot more than you will notice the difference in tone. The "x" in Hooke's Law is the difference in length of the string or spring, not the sideways displacement, i.e., you've got to look at it as a right triangle with the string as the hypotenuse. Do the math {hyp = sqrt (a^2 + b^2), where a= the displacement and b= the distance from bridge to fret}. How much farther {as a ratio of (hyp-b) to b} do you stretch the string when the action is a little higher compared to the straight line distance from the bridge to the fret? Not much.