- Thread starter moanjam
- Start date
Big Poppa
Well-known member
The Stainless STeel
LesPaul667
New member
- Joined
- May 22, 2011
- Messages
- 4
Hi Brian,
This is my first post, since I found this topic by Google. I have a severe nickel allergy which started around 6 years ago, and I've been playing for 35 years. I called EB Customer service last week and was told the plain strings in the Stainless Steel Slinky sets have nickel in them. Can you confirm this?
Thanks!
DCStingray
Well-known member
Hey LesPaul667,
I'm one of the engineers here at Ernie Ball. You don't have to worry about any nickel on the plain strings. The plain strings are made of specially tempered tin plated high carbon steel. As Brian stated, a set of stainless steel strings are completely nickel-free.
-Chris
I'm one of the engineers here at Ernie Ball. You don't have to worry about any nickel on the plain strings. The plain strings are made of specially tempered tin plated high carbon steel. As Brian stated, a set of stainless steel strings are completely nickel-free.
-Chris
Last edited:
LesPaul667
New member
- Joined
- May 22, 2011
- Messages
- 4
Thank you very much for the speedy reply, Chris!
I guess the person I talked to on the phone there didn't know their strings too well. I still get the allergy on my fingers with the SS strings, so I guess it's the nickel in the frets that's causing it. I like the EB Stainless Slinkys, so I'll stick to using them then.
I'd try stainless steel frets, but I understand they contain nickel, to an extent. I'm thinking of the new EVO gold/copper alloy wire, since it's Nickel-Free. Any suggestions on fret wire?
How much nickel
Wow. What a surprise to find out that Ernie Ball PURE NICKEL strings are, wait for it,
PURE NICKEL! LOL!
Wow. What a surprise to find out that Ernie Ball PURE NICKEL strings are, wait for it,
PURE NICKEL! LOL!
DCStingray
Well-known member
@ LesPaul667,
I believe you may be correct in assuming that the frets are what are causing your irritation. Furthermore, it is definitely possible that the grade of stainless used for fret wire contains nickel, but different vendors may use different alloys. The EVO is definitely a great solution for nickel free frets - it bends easy and is completely nickel free. However, the EVO is very expensive. As you probably know, the color is more similar to bronze unlike nickel silver or stainless steel frets.
I believe you may be correct in assuming that the frets are what are causing your irritation. Furthermore, it is definitely possible that the grade of stainless used for fret wire contains nickel, but different vendors may use different alloys. The EVO is definitely a great solution for nickel free frets - it bends easy and is completely nickel free. However, the EVO is very expensive. As you probably know, the color is more similar to bronze unlike nickel silver or stainless steel frets.
Microbaroms
Active member
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2010
- Messages
- 36
I feel I may be able to help a little here, because I have suffered from such a nickel allergy.
However, before I develop that subject, I do wish to express my immense thanks to the superb Ernie Balls Customer Service, and the guys at Strings and Things for their Professional and Rapid Assistance. In particular, I would thank the excellent JM Quinn, AJ Braman and Nick Clubb, though everyone seems to be particularly good at their job at the Factory!
There is no doubt that at EBMM there is conspiracy inspired at the top, where people and the attention they give to their work make the entire difference, that keeps Great Musical Instrument Design & Manufacturing still available to a desiring public and EBMM the Creme De La Creme.
Nickle Allergy is quite a common occurrence, and in reality, a form of Dermatitis.
For the female sex, ear rings with Nickle content usually cause redness and itching around the ears, and are often the earliest indicator of sensitivity.
For the male sex, watch backs (even those they state on them that they are made from Stainless Steel usually have a small degree of Nickle in fact), and so the inside of the wrist is usually the earliest indicator of sensitivity.
I do not present myself as an expert on this subject, but rather as an individual with profound empirical experience over a great many decades, covering personal use, product and customer experience, and manufacturing issues regarding this matter of concern, which involves very, very few Players, in reality.
The good news I have to give you, is that often, when the problem is experienced it is not caused simply by one thing in my personal view (thought it can wrongly appear for that to be the case), and that there are a number of interrelated issues, which are in fact, usually involved in creating the actual problem for an individual.
Because the Ends of Players Fingers, build a thick wad of dead-ish skin tissue that is highly protective, I am possessed of the belief that for the most part and most people, the absolute minimal contact involved with Strings and Frets, on such a small portion of 'thickly desensitised skin', are unlikely to be the REAL reason, underlying any problem that might occur.
Usually Cleaning Products such as Soap and Detergents etc, are often also involved but completely overlooked, as are Toiletry Products, After Shaves and Perfumes. Rubber, Metal and Garden Plants and Chemicals can also be detrimentally involved in such a complaint, and this is also often overlooked, the environment in which exposure and the problem occurs.
Excessive, repeated hand washing, promoting continual contact, often with detergent chemicals, removing the skins natural oils which build up only after a considerable hours may be a factor involved for certain people
To me, it is no coincidence that in hot and humid weather, the sweaty area underneath a watch back or behind an ear, in contact with the skin is where things become a problem and first noticed. For this reason many watch makers place a clear plastic barrier on the watch back (which should be left on the watch but is usually removed) and some even supply watches with a hinged plastic back as protection. I owned such a watch and for a time it was the only one I could wear at all.
On a practical point then, simply removing the moisture of sweat regularly, keeping small towel handy for ones fingertips and hands can thus assist a Player whose hands might well be perspiring during a busy Session. Furthermore, the type of more natural Neck Finish found on so very many EBMM Instruments, are less likely than those found most available alternative Instruments, some of which definitely cause excessive sweat in the first place.
So I think you are far better off with an EBMM Instrument, than most others, in this important respect.
Another point is, it is my observation that there is a degree of what I would broadly call a 'super sensitised nervous system' involved in the occurrence of this complaint, and possibly a psychological element, or a psychosomatic component. Please appreciate, the allergy is not caused by such a condition, but it is 'greatly increased and exacerbated' by anxiety, nervousness and stress, elsewhere in the individuals life.
Eliminating far more common sources of aggravation, for example using a neutral Ph soap etc, and dealing with the underlying causes of negative stress in one's life, in my humble opinion may prove to be far more productive in controlling and overcoming the effects of such an allergy, and much more helpful than any great concern regarding level of the Nickle Content in Guitar and Bass Strings.
And I write as someone who could not even wear a watch on his wrist for some time because of sensitivity to Nickle content.
In my experience, dealing with soaps, overcoming issues that cause great stress (Stress can creep up on us unawares, and build over time) and carefully controlling particular areas where sweat is focussed, so that things do not get out of hand in the first place (cleaning the Instrument regularly and properly plays a part here), and giving yourself the needed time to completely get over any occurrence of allergy experience, should meant that finally, in the end worrying about Strings and Frets, should not be an issue at all for you in any way shape or form.
It is difficult to imagine, any more minimal or desensitised a point of contact than a String Fret or Finger Tip of deadened Skin.
If you want to deal with this issue, look at the problem in as broad a way as possible, carefully observe the conditions, cause and effects involved and eventually, you will be able to bring things into control to a point where String Materials and Frets are a non issue.
For it is probably the case that there are in fact a 'number of other elements' that you are also allergic to, but completely unaware of as yet, and tracing these and dealing with them will be important in completely eliminating the problem.
This is my considered opinion with many, many, many decades of observation, experience and dealing with Players Requirements, Musical Instruments and Manufacturing Industry.
Quote: "I have a severe nickel allergy which started around 6 years ago, and I've been playing for 35 years."
This confirms the truth of all that I have written above.
If the Strings or Frets were the REAL problem, (I concede that they may appear to be part of the problem for a short while) then the difficulty would have obviously arisen long, long ago.
You can't play for 29 years, and it 'suddenly appear' and for the Strings and Frets to be the real culprit. In my experience, there are other factors which when taken fully into account and dealt with, will restore the previous healthy experience with Guitars and Basses for the individual involved.
That is an unassailable axiomatic truth that is impossible to get around.
Best Wishes to all!
P
However, before I develop that subject, I do wish to express my immense thanks to the superb Ernie Balls Customer Service, and the guys at Strings and Things for their Professional and Rapid Assistance. In particular, I would thank the excellent JM Quinn, AJ Braman and Nick Clubb, though everyone seems to be particularly good at their job at the Factory!
There is no doubt that at EBMM there is conspiracy inspired at the top, where people and the attention they give to their work make the entire difference, that keeps Great Musical Instrument Design & Manufacturing still available to a desiring public and EBMM the Creme De La Creme.
Nickle Allergy is quite a common occurrence, and in reality, a form of Dermatitis.
For the female sex, ear rings with Nickle content usually cause redness and itching around the ears, and are often the earliest indicator of sensitivity.
For the male sex, watch backs (even those they state on them that they are made from Stainless Steel usually have a small degree of Nickle in fact), and so the inside of the wrist is usually the earliest indicator of sensitivity.
I do not present myself as an expert on this subject, but rather as an individual with profound empirical experience over a great many decades, covering personal use, product and customer experience, and manufacturing issues regarding this matter of concern, which involves very, very few Players, in reality.
The good news I have to give you, is that often, when the problem is experienced it is not caused simply by one thing in my personal view (thought it can wrongly appear for that to be the case), and that there are a number of interrelated issues, which are in fact, usually involved in creating the actual problem for an individual.
Because the Ends of Players Fingers, build a thick wad of dead-ish skin tissue that is highly protective, I am possessed of the belief that for the most part and most people, the absolute minimal contact involved with Strings and Frets, on such a small portion of 'thickly desensitised skin', are unlikely to be the REAL reason, underlying any problem that might occur.
Usually Cleaning Products such as Soap and Detergents etc, are often also involved but completely overlooked, as are Toiletry Products, After Shaves and Perfumes. Rubber, Metal and Garden Plants and Chemicals can also be detrimentally involved in such a complaint, and this is also often overlooked, the environment in which exposure and the problem occurs.
Excessive, repeated hand washing, promoting continual contact, often with detergent chemicals, removing the skins natural oils which build up only after a considerable hours may be a factor involved for certain people
To me, it is no coincidence that in hot and humid weather, the sweaty area underneath a watch back or behind an ear, in contact with the skin is where things become a problem and first noticed. For this reason many watch makers place a clear plastic barrier on the watch back (which should be left on the watch but is usually removed) and some even supply watches with a hinged plastic back as protection. I owned such a watch and for a time it was the only one I could wear at all.
On a practical point then, simply removing the moisture of sweat regularly, keeping small towel handy for ones fingertips and hands can thus assist a Player whose hands might well be perspiring during a busy Session. Furthermore, the type of more natural Neck Finish found on so very many EBMM Instruments, are less likely than those found most available alternative Instruments, some of which definitely cause excessive sweat in the first place.
So I think you are far better off with an EBMM Instrument, than most others, in this important respect.
Another point is, it is my observation that there is a degree of what I would broadly call a 'super sensitised nervous system' involved in the occurrence of this complaint, and possibly a psychological element, or a psychosomatic component. Please appreciate, the allergy is not caused by such a condition, but it is 'greatly increased and exacerbated' by anxiety, nervousness and stress, elsewhere in the individuals life.
Eliminating far more common sources of aggravation, for example using a neutral Ph soap etc, and dealing with the underlying causes of negative stress in one's life, in my humble opinion may prove to be far more productive in controlling and overcoming the effects of such an allergy, and much more helpful than any great concern regarding level of the Nickle Content in Guitar and Bass Strings.
And I write as someone who could not even wear a watch on his wrist for some time because of sensitivity to Nickle content.
In my experience, dealing with soaps, overcoming issues that cause great stress (Stress can creep up on us unawares, and build over time) and carefully controlling particular areas where sweat is focussed, so that things do not get out of hand in the first place (cleaning the Instrument regularly and properly plays a part here), and giving yourself the needed time to completely get over any occurrence of allergy experience, should meant that finally, in the end worrying about Strings and Frets, should not be an issue at all for you in any way shape or form.
It is difficult to imagine, any more minimal or desensitised a point of contact than a String Fret or Finger Tip of deadened Skin.
If you want to deal with this issue, look at the problem in as broad a way as possible, carefully observe the conditions, cause and effects involved and eventually, you will be able to bring things into control to a point where String Materials and Frets are a non issue.
For it is probably the case that there are in fact a 'number of other elements' that you are also allergic to, but completely unaware of as yet, and tracing these and dealing with them will be important in completely eliminating the problem.
This is my considered opinion with many, many, many decades of observation, experience and dealing with Players Requirements, Musical Instruments and Manufacturing Industry.
Quote: "I have a severe nickel allergy which started around 6 years ago, and I've been playing for 35 years."
This confirms the truth of all that I have written above.
If the Strings or Frets were the REAL problem, (I concede that they may appear to be part of the problem for a short while) then the difficulty would have obviously arisen long, long ago.
You can't play for 29 years, and it 'suddenly appear' and for the Strings and Frets to be the real culprit. In my experience, there are other factors which when taken fully into account and dealt with, will restore the previous healthy experience with Guitars and Basses for the individual involved.
That is an unassailable axiomatic truth that is impossible to get around.
Best Wishes to all!
P
Last edited:
rickbadertscher
New member
- Joined
- Jun 23, 2011
- Messages
- 1
Dude, you don't know what you're talking about. You can't alieviate symptoms of a nickel allergy by reducing stress or mediatating on it or whatever, you need to not have contact with nickel.
Also, you are not necesserily born with an allergy, an allergy is the immune system attacking what it considers a foreign element. Your immune system can just decide one day that nickel is a foreign element, and once it does it can't go back.
So all you nickel dermatitis sufferers like me, do your best to elimate nickel from **** you touch, like your guitar. Also from your diet, many foods contain nickel. Also, dermal steroid injections from a dermatologist are very effective for extreme reactions, like open wounds from extended nickel exposure.
Also, you are not necesserily born with an allergy, an allergy is the immune system attacking what it considers a foreign element. Your immune system can just decide one day that nickel is a foreign element, and once it does it can't go back.
So all you nickel dermatitis sufferers like me, do your best to elimate nickel from **** you touch, like your guitar. Also from your diet, many foods contain nickel. Also, dermal steroid injections from a dermatologist are very effective for extreme reactions, like open wounds from extended nickel exposure.
Microbaroms
Active member
- Joined
- Oct 2, 2010
- Messages
- 36
Quote: "So all you nickel dermatitis sufferers like me, do your best to elimate nickel from **** you touch, like your guitar"
Thank you for your viewpoint.
Though, I am unfamiliar with "elimate" or "****".
However, like yourself, in the past, I have suffered very seriously from nickel dermatitis, but found that there a great many contributory factors, that can heighten and exacerbate the condition.
Quite understandably, it is an axiomatic truth in life, that people like simple straightforward answers to problems, but it is often the case, that before we can effectively solve a problem, it is often helpful to determine whether the problem, is in fact simple one or a rather complex one.
Simple problems require simple solutions, but more difficult and tenacious problems, require far more complex solutions to finally, completely overcome and resolve them. Because complex problems, often appear on the surface to be very simple, they are regularly misunderstood or misdiagnosed, and thus simple solutions are regularly applied, that fail to completely resolve such maladies.
In my view.
Whether you personally, accept it or not.
Allergies can be extremely complex problems indeed, to completely resolve.
However, the remarkable fact is, that "this dude that doesn't know what he's talking about" though being allergic to nickel, enjoys a formidable array of Historic Musical Instruments, and deliberately chooses to string most of them, with Nickel Wound Products.
Because Allergies can be so complex, and the many differing components that contribute to, heighten and exacerbate the Allergy can be difficult to determine readily. Often the problem is caused by a tiny exposure here and another little bit there, often in products and Foods we are completely unaware will affect us.
This widespread but minimal exposure can often build over time without too much trouble, till a point is reached where after being suddenly exposed to a Product that clearly contains the active ingredient, a strong reaction occurs. And we or others make the connection that "whatever the active ingredient is" is what causes the Allergy.
Although when at its peak, any exposure would have caused an outbreak or reaction. What I succeeded in achieving, was eliminating the huge number of tiny contributing elements and factors that underlay an occurrence of the condition. Eventually, I was able through properly understanding it, to bring the condition into such a relatively stable point of control that I have for the last ten years, been completely free from the negative effects of Nickel Allergy, and can thus bear the exposure to Nickel Strings without any problem whatever.
Here is a list of foods that can exacerbate the condition of Nickel Allergy.
Asparagus
Baking Powder
Beans
Cabbage
Corn
Cocoa
Herrings
Mushrooms
Oysters
Peanuts
Pears
Peas
Raisins
Rhubarb
Spinach
Sprouts
Tea
Tomatoes
Whole meal Flour
All Canned Foods
Of course.
There may well be a great many other factors that additionally contribute to the occurrence of the condition.
We know do we not that heart Attacks can be exacerbated by exposure to Stress. Indeed, it is the case that Ulcers, and Serious Digestive Problems can be symptomatic of Stress.
Environmental factors, most especially Temperature and Humidity were certainly involved in creating the conditions in which my Nickel Allergy exposed itself. And environmental factors are a recognized prerequisite for a great number of debilitating medical conditions.
Prayer, meditation, being reflective, and the right type of thinking, have all been empirically proven to have tremendously positive effect, in a wide ranging numbers of conditions. And it is an absolute fact, that simply washing, can greatly help.
Why one might suppose, they could not be an additional assistance in this case, is quite beyond my powers of cognizance.
With respect, it seems through my eyes, to be a deeply self limiting, self defeating, approach.
As a Musical Instrument Lover.
My purpose in writing, is merely to provide hope and encouragement.
That the problem may with the right approach, be controlled, overcome, and effectively defeated.
And thus, wish you well, and that you might find over time, as I did, a way to completely overcome the condition, and enjoy Music.
Best Wishes for a Speedy Recovery
P
Thank you for your viewpoint.
Though, I am unfamiliar with "elimate" or "****".
However, like yourself, in the past, I have suffered very seriously from nickel dermatitis, but found that there a great many contributory factors, that can heighten and exacerbate the condition.
Quite understandably, it is an axiomatic truth in life, that people like simple straightforward answers to problems, but it is often the case, that before we can effectively solve a problem, it is often helpful to determine whether the problem, is in fact simple one or a rather complex one.
Simple problems require simple solutions, but more difficult and tenacious problems, require far more complex solutions to finally, completely overcome and resolve them. Because complex problems, often appear on the surface to be very simple, they are regularly misunderstood or misdiagnosed, and thus simple solutions are regularly applied, that fail to completely resolve such maladies.
In my view.
Whether you personally, accept it or not.
Allergies can be extremely complex problems indeed, to completely resolve.
However, the remarkable fact is, that "this dude that doesn't know what he's talking about" though being allergic to nickel, enjoys a formidable array of Historic Musical Instruments, and deliberately chooses to string most of them, with Nickel Wound Products.
Because Allergies can be so complex, and the many differing components that contribute to, heighten and exacerbate the Allergy can be difficult to determine readily. Often the problem is caused by a tiny exposure here and another little bit there, often in products and Foods we are completely unaware will affect us.
This widespread but minimal exposure can often build over time without too much trouble, till a point is reached where after being suddenly exposed to a Product that clearly contains the active ingredient, a strong reaction occurs. And we or others make the connection that "whatever the active ingredient is" is what causes the Allergy.
Although when at its peak, any exposure would have caused an outbreak or reaction. What I succeeded in achieving, was eliminating the huge number of tiny contributing elements and factors that underlay an occurrence of the condition. Eventually, I was able through properly understanding it, to bring the condition into such a relatively stable point of control that I have for the last ten years, been completely free from the negative effects of Nickel Allergy, and can thus bear the exposure to Nickel Strings without any problem whatever.
Here is a list of foods that can exacerbate the condition of Nickel Allergy.
Asparagus
Baking Powder
Beans
Cabbage
Corn
Cocoa
Herrings
Mushrooms
Oysters
Peanuts
Pears
Peas
Raisins
Rhubarb
Spinach
Sprouts
Tea
Tomatoes
Whole meal Flour
All Canned Foods
Of course.
There may well be a great many other factors that additionally contribute to the occurrence of the condition.
We know do we not that heart Attacks can be exacerbated by exposure to Stress. Indeed, it is the case that Ulcers, and Serious Digestive Problems can be symptomatic of Stress.
Environmental factors, most especially Temperature and Humidity were certainly involved in creating the conditions in which my Nickel Allergy exposed itself. And environmental factors are a recognized prerequisite for a great number of debilitating medical conditions.
Prayer, meditation, being reflective, and the right type of thinking, have all been empirically proven to have tremendously positive effect, in a wide ranging numbers of conditions. And it is an absolute fact, that simply washing, can greatly help.
Why one might suppose, they could not be an additional assistance in this case, is quite beyond my powers of cognizance.
With respect, it seems through my eyes, to be a deeply self limiting, self defeating, approach.
As a Musical Instrument Lover.
My purpose in writing, is merely to provide hope and encouragement.
That the problem may with the right approach, be controlled, overcome, and effectively defeated.
And thus, wish you well, and that you might find over time, as I did, a way to completely overcome the condition, and enjoy Music.
Best Wishes for a Speedy Recovery
P
Hi DCStingray, In your opinion what strings would wear slowest when I use a steel pick? Will the tin get chewed up?
DCStingray
Well-known member
Hi sldsnd!
I would guess that stainless steel strings would wear the slowest. The tin plating on the plain strings might get chewed up a bit from the pick, but there isn't any other option for the plain strings.
I would guess that stainless steel strings would wear the slowest. The tin plating on the plain strings might get chewed up a bit from the pick, but there isn't any other option for the plain strings.
Last edited:
BigCapacitor
New member
- Joined
- Nov 18, 2011
- Messages
- 1
I want to make sure everyone here understands something about "stainless steel" and nickel allergy. It could come across that stainless is ALWAYS nickel free (from the posts here), and this is absolutely not true. Some manufacturers may specifically produce a product that is nickel free, but in general nickel is in stainless steel, it is just locked up better in the atomic matrix so less likely to pose a problem by seeping out from sweat contact. You can learn a lot about nickel allergy at Nickel Free Jewelry, Watches, Belts and more! if you want to know more. I prefer strings that are NOT stainless AND advertise "nickel free" just to be safe. Also, at first I had minimal benefit but that was because I forgot the frets! Stupid but remedied .
.LesPaul667
New member
- Joined
- May 22, 2011
- Messages
- 4
I have another question-
From what I understand, unless the wound strings (stainless or carbon steel otherwise) is not of the 18/0 Stainless Steel grade(the '0' being the nickel content) that there would be nickel content regardless.
DCStingray
Well-known member
I cannot comment on the grade of stainless used, but I can once again confirm that our stainless steel strings are nickel free. I would also like to add that our new Cobalt strings are nickel free. We were very excited about being able to provide another alternative for players with nickel allergies.
Jahanasaurus
Member
Once again, I can't wait to try the new cobalts when they hit the UK! Seemingly a high number of people have a reaction to Cobalt too.. lets hope it isn't me!
LesPaul667
New member
- Joined
- May 22, 2011
- Messages
- 4
Thanks for the tip, the problem is that I'm allergic to both nickel *and* cobalt(supposedly if you're allergic to one, you're usually allergic to *both*). These were the 2 metals that came up positive in my allergy patch tests.
As you can see my alternatives are slim to none lol.
What strings??? HELP!
My son has a nickel allergy which we have been battling for over a year now. When we found the cobalt strings we were ecstatic! After completing the patch tests we have discovered he has the cobalt allergy as well. I have read that a chrome allergy usually goes along with these, although I need to see if chromium was included in his patch test because I am not sure.
What alternative strings can we try? What is out there???
Thanks for the tip, the problem is that I'm allergic to both nickel *and* cobalt(supposedly if you're allergic to one, you're usually allergic to *both*). These were the 2 metals that came up positive in my allergy patch tests.
As you can see my alternatives are slim to none lol.
My son has a nickel allergy which we have been battling for over a year now. When we found the cobalt strings we were ecstatic! After completing the patch tests we have discovered he has the cobalt allergy as well. I have read that a chrome allergy usually goes along with these, although I need to see if chromium was included in his patch test because I am not sure.
What alternative strings can we try? What is out there???
Flashnball
Member
Hi! We offer stainless steel strings as well. They are both nickel and cobalt free!
Ernie Ball | Electric Strings[501]=4586
Ernie Ball | Electric Strings[501]=4586
