Relic'd guitars

[Roubster]

I can understand the 'relic' thing from a collectors point of view that is a music fanatic but does not play guitar and probably is loaded to waste money on something that intrinsically is probably not even meant to be played. I think a lot of people focus WAYYYYYY too much on the appearances of guitars and what the pro guitar players do with them and what little tricks or changes they make...instead of actually focusing on playing more and creating their own style and music. I myself get a little hung up on this sometimes, but I play more than worrying about whether my favorite guitar player changed pickups and I have to do the same exact thing. Steve Morse is my all time favorite musician, but I would NEVER buy an exact reproduction of his #1...I have a nice clean Y2D that has his name on it, but the guitar itself works very well for me as it is and when I play I dont even see the damn thing hahaha. I just play and try and get better and better.

 

[tommydude]

Personally, placing a ding in my guitars non-intentionally always made me upset with myself for being so negligent....

Paying someone else to beat up a guitar for me, then pay full price just does not make sense

Now, if I buy a "used" guitar that has a ding or nick, that makes sense since the price would accommodate for the flaws.

When I bought my first Axis, the local GC gave me a discounted price for the dings! The guitar was brand new, but a non-caring player accidentally put some nicks in it and hung it back up on the wall.......

 

[tommyindelaware]

ok.....i wouldnt buy a relic.........but i do buy stonewashed jeans.....am i a bad person ??????

 

[aleclee]

I know F*nder rolls the edges on alot of their mass production American guitars , but that relic had that broken in feeling down pat.

IMO, that's the one compelling thing about relics. Sadly, most seem to emphasize the marks left by soldering irons and sanders rather than the feel of a worn-in neck. Color me unimpressed when it comes to hard edges on a fretboard when there are holes worn in the finish elsewhere.

 

[Ripper]

Simply put it this way:

Knuckleheads like their gear clean and nice. Aint it?

 

[straycat113]

Great answer Rob-"I just play and try to get better and better" it cannot be put any better.

You spend money on a high end guitar to get the best tone and playability that an instrument has to offer, and here everyone feels that guitar is an EBMM. I also believe that it is great having a wicked looking finish or top, and so do most people who watch you play. I also have nothing against anyone who collects guitars and maybe can only play three chords but can see the beauty I believe we all see in guitars, and acquire them for that reason.

The issue that really bothers me though is that percentage of guys who everyone knows as a cork sniffer that thumbs their nose down at the gear of other players, are not really players themselves and buy the highest priced instruments as if they were investing in the stock market, as they even have brokers who guide them on what to buy along with portfolios. There is no doubt in my mind, and I would not even say that it is even arguable that all those high priced relics are marketed for them, as once a guitar is way out of the reach of a gigging musician and cost over 10K that says it all. I can understand some players like Norrin liking a guitar with a relic'ed finish that is affordable and would not argue they play great, but that is not the main reason for these guitars that cost as much as a new car believe me. I have spent too much time on the Fender boards and most guys are not shy as to their objective.=resale value.

I know we all like to see our guitars go up in value, or at least retain their original price and in 10 or 20 years if you are lucky to have bought some guitars that you enjoyed playing spike in value that is great. But it really irks me to see guitars made that are targeted for glass cases and bank vaults and the guys who are the buyers of them acting like a bunch of rich idiots.

To sum it up best sometime ago I had made a post that went- if you had an uncle who passed away and your aunt knew you played guitar and said your Uncle had a guitar for ages in the closet and she wanted you to have it and it turned out to be a 54 Strat, what condition would you want the guitar to be in. It was no shock to me that it was something like 31-0 Mint.lol Their was not even one played and broken in, also most guys said they would sell it and buy all new gear.

 

[D.K.]

Buying a really old used EBMM Silo or Morse (since those are the only models from the first years of EBMM guitar proiduction), with scars and all, broken in - be my guest! Yes, the scars are not mine, but those guitars have a great build quality, wonderful feel and sound from being played all those years and all that at a reasonable price.

Buying a totally overopriced mock up - no way. Would You pay 3-4 times more to live in a house, which a hollywood studio has just built and made it look "aged"? The point is, all the pros of the well played instrument, other than the worn looks, are non-existent on "relics" - especially not the tone of wood that has been resonating for decades. Elminate the pros and pay much more - now that sure is a sound reasoning.

Although I know some Fender collectors here in Germany, who in all honesty tell me, the relic versions CS Strats sound better than the non-relics... Well, hearing is believing, I guess.

 

[Barny]

Anyone who buys a guitar is expressing there individual choice, I have personally owned a few relic guitars. They were really great sounding guitars with a distinctly comfortable worn in feel, however after playing my first Musicman (Rosewood Neck Axis Super Sport) I have slowy swapped out all my other brand guitars for Musicman guitars.

Why did I buy relics in the first place? Because I was in to that particular brand at the time and personally I thought they looked cool. Ultimately they werent for me, after 17 years playing, with Musicman I found not only a guitar that was perfect for me but an entire range of them.

My dad is still a steadfast "F*****" man who owns three Custom shop Relics. He loves that style of guitar, he loves the specs and he loves the look and the vibe of the wear and he is really happy with them. Im pretty sure he doesnt spend any time thinking about if he has been ripped off or if his guitars hold up to original models from 1957 that he would never be able to afford.

One thing about all this that does annoy me is that I took a well played in guitar to trade against my roasted maple order and got a real lowball offer because of the condition, the guy in the shop agreed that it made no sense that real wear de-values an isntrument when people pay a premium to buy a new guitar with simulated wear.

 

[fbecir]

One thing about all this that does annoy me is that I took a well played in guitar to trade against my roasted maple order and got a real lowball offer because of the condition, the guy in the shop agreed that it made no sense that real wear de-values an isntrument when people pay a premium to buy a new guitar with simulated wear.

Interesting !
What is the price of a second hand relic guitar ? Is it cheaper than a "new" relic ? If the relic buyers are logical, they should pay more for a second hand relic

 

[D.K.]

The price for, say, a real '57 strat in a more or less original condition is many times higher, than the comparable new CS relic. So, yes, in a certain way it's logical, in a sense, that it doesn't only look old, it also sounds and feels like it.

However, why a reliced custom shop fender should cost up to 6-7 times more than a well used 6-bolt silo from the late 80s is beyond me.

 

[Barny]

Interesting !
What is the price of a second hand relic guitar ? Is it cheaper than a "new" relic ? If the relic buyers are logical, they should pay more for a second hand relic

LOL I like your thinking!!

Funnily enough the last one that my dad bought, he went in to the shop specifically to buy that guitar, couldnt make his mind up, he went home to sleep on the decision. The next day the guitar was sold. Two weeks later the same guitar went up on the shops used section several hundred £ cheaper but in the same (battered) condition.

I guess this comes down to the shop involved, these guitars could go back on the shelf as "new" and no one would know.

 

[fbecir]

I guess this comes down to the shop involved, these guitars could go back on the shelf as "new" and no one would know.

At least, in the shop your father visited, the guys are honest, they reduced the price and presented the guitar as second hand. I am not sure that it's always the case.

 

[Barny]

At least, in the shop your father visited, the guys are honest, they reduced the price and presented the guitar as second hand. I am not sure that it's always the case.

A few European Knuckleheads reccomended the shop (Coda Music) in the Roasted Maple Thread. I bought my first guitar in there when I was 14 way back in 93 and have never bought from any other guitar shop since.

One of the most frustrating things about being a Musicman convert is that in the UK you are in a minority. The guitar shop in question is a main Musicman dealer, the last time I was in there they had probably 40+ Relics and 4 BFR Musicman guitars. I guess this is indicative of the demand.

Lots of other companies seem to be jumping on the relic bandwagon, which I dont really have any particular feelings about one or another, but I am happy that Musicman seem more devoted to development and innovation than artificial ageing of guitars. I am personally much more excited to be waiting for my Roasted Maple reflex with the series parallel switching, mahogany toneblock, chambered body and Roasted neck than I ever was waiting for my "same old guitar" but red and reliced.

 

[Brand X]

A few European Knuckleheads reccomended the shop (Coda Music) in the Roasted Maple Thread. I bought my first guitar in there when I was 14 way back in 93 and have never bought from any other guitar shop since.

One of the most frustrating things about being a Musicman convert is that in the UK you are in a minority. The guitar shop in question is a main Musicman dealer, the last time I was in there they had probably 40+ Relics and 4 BFR Musicman guitars. I guess this is indicative of the demand.

Lots of other companies seem to be jumping on the relic bandwagon, which I dont really have any particular feelings about one or another, but I am happy that Musicman seem more devoted to development and innovation than artificial ageing of guitars. I am personally much more excited to be waiting for my Roasted Maple reflex with the series parallel switching, mahogany toneblock, chambered body and Roasted neck than I ever was waiting for my "same old guitar" but red and reliced.

I've been down to Coda a few times as well as all the main chainstores - the prob;lem with these places is the pressure put on them by Gibson / Fender etc dictating that so much wallspace is dedicated to their product...this squeezes out the other builders......

I get really frustrated at the lack of dealers - but then on the other hand, I love playing guitars that are so rare over here!

 

[aulo]

I think we need to separate relic's into two separate categories:

1) Cosmetic relic's (paintjob)

2) Comprehensive, total relic's (true relic)

It seems to me form what I've read in this thread, that the majority of members are opposed or at least take issue with the second form. In the second form, a lot goes into making the guitar not only look, but feel and sound old. Although I am not too familiar with it, I'm guessing that a lot of measures are taken to ensure that the right woods, paints, electronics and hardware is chosen to make the 'new' guitar old.

In the first case, artists simply like the look of roughed up paint and decide to choose it as their guitar's finish (as opposed to a gloss, matte or sparkle). Just think of this scenario as just another color option. It isn't for everybody, but neither is gloss black - that's why there is a plethora of finish options.

In Ian Thornley's case, he took an old stock Morse that he had bought back in his Berklee days, and took it out in his backyard and put a belt sander to it. That's what Pat Benti (Ian's friend/tech/guitar player) told me. Ian swaps the electronics out of it on almost a monthly basis - a bona fide Frankenstein.

I guess what I'm getting at is don't lump relic's into one category. The majority of posts in this thread are concerning total, comprehensive (true) relics and not the ones that are purely cosmetic like Ian's.

They're two completely different things. One's a paintjob, the other is a new guitar made old.

 

[sandmannn69]

Beyond me why someone would buy a beat-up looking guitar for full price or even more due to the sanding job. My Axis SS is a year old and the only thing worn out on it is the fretwire. It plays like a broken-in guitar since the day I bought it new but still in mint condition and I want it to stay that way.

 

[Mpcoluv]

The old Cunetto relics were pretty fine guitars. The whole relic thing IMHO is only valid to the guys who crave vintage instruments but can't or are unwilling to pay the ridiculous price.
My first EMBB was a 6 bolt silo from the early '90s (because Keef played one).
My second was a '94 AL in pink burst.
Both were great guitars but not a vintage "Holy Grail".
One of my friends used to have a 58 Les Paul that he bought in '71 or so. He played it every day from 71 to the mod 90's. It had all the relicing a person could want.
It was not the greatest guitar ever. It did nothing for me, even though I was a Les Paul guy then.
Relicing is a lot like a a b@@b job. Looks real from a distance but...

 

[Big Poppa]

Ifmit makes someone happy then they should play them. I just don't want to make them

 

[Mpcoluv]

BP, you don't need to make relics, the "Golden Age" of EBMM guitars is NOW.
That can't be said for some of the other manufacturers.
Plus the necks have that worn in feel out of the box.

 

[koogie2k]

I relic mine the old fashion way...I play the heck out of them.
To each his own...either way as long as you are playing that is what matters.