Theory quesiton...naming of modes

[adouglas]

There are no stupid questions. Well, there are, but I don't think this is one of them.

I understand the idea behind modes and the definition of them. What has never been explained is a simple thing about naming them.

Say you've got C major.

C-D-E-F-G-A-B

The aeolian mode of C major starts on the 6th degree of the scale, which is A. This of course yields A minor

A-B-C-D-E-F-G

Here's the question:

Is that called C Aeolian or A Aeolian?

The basic definition of modes doesn't give you that information, and you can look at it either way:

- The scale starting on the sixth note of C major is C Aeolian...the mode taking the name of the parent scale, or
- The scale starting on the sixth note of C major is A Aeolian...the mode taking the name of the root of the new scale

Which is it?

TIA....

 

[mesadualrec]

To my knowledge it would be A aeolian


because C aeolian would comprise of different notes and is the 6th mode of the Eb major scale


hoep all that is correct

 

[mesadualrec]

Also if you were working diatonically through the C major scale
C Ionian
D Dorian
E Phrygian
F Lydian
G Mixolydian
A Aeolian
B Locrian

each also has a chord
C major
D minor
E minor
F major
G major
A minor
and B Diminished

and the reflective modes also take on those tonalities

hope that has helped too

 

[phatduckk]

this stuff always confuses the hell out of me. i wish i woulda taken some classes in college

 

[KennethB]

Yes, aeolian scale and natural minor scale contain the same notes.

 

[adouglas]

Yes, aeolian scale and natural minor scale contain the same notes.

That's exactly the root (pardon) of the question.

I know that those two scales have the same notes. I just didn't know what note name to slap on the scale.

I've got it straight now, thanks all....

The mode takes the name of the first note in the scale of the MODE, not the name of the parent scale.

So, if someone says "play a G myxolydian scale" I now know that I play G-A-B-C-D-E-F, (myxolydian scale built off of the fifth degree of C major) not the myxolydian scale built off of the fifth degree of G major (i.e. starting on D).

Right?

 

[KennethB]

Yes, correct. G Mixolydian, G to G in C major.
Learn chords more than scales.

 

[Ponch]

IMHO it would be better to learn the formulas of the modes, learn all those in every positions. So you don't have to think 'twice' to count the degree from the root position and etc..it's really too confusing for some people.

 

[Ponch]

Yes, correct. G Mixolydian, G to G in C major.
Learn chords more than scales.

Imho chords actually are the scales, and either way .. so once we nailed down the scales then we can start to build chords based on the interval harmony structure (triad).

 

[Colin]

what about the notes in the C demolished scale?

 

[robelinda2]

is that like C Demented ???

 

[Ponch]

is that like C Demented ???

LOL

 

[Benjamin T]

IMHO it would be better to learn the formulas of the modes, learn all those in every positions. So you don't have to think 'twice' to count the degree from the root position and etc..it's really too confusing for some people.

+1

It doesn't make sense to only have it down in a few positions - get 'em all down and know where every mode starts and ends.

 

[CaptainFingers]

Also if you were working diatonically through the C major scale
C Ionian
D Dorian
E Phrygian
F Lydian
G Mixolydian
A Aeolian
B Locrian

each also has a chord
C major
D minor
E minor
F major
G major
A minor
and B Diminished

and the reflective modes also take on those tonalities

hope that has helped too

The 7th mode (Locrian), in this case B Locrian, will be Half-Diminished NOT Diminished; having only 7 notes and not 8 as in fully diminished scale. In this case, the chord would be called B half-diminished or Bm7b5.

 

[adouglas]

This has all been hugely helpful, folks.

I also found some good stuff on a website:

Diatonic Scales and Modes - Free guitar lessons
Music Theory Guitar Lessons - Modes And Modal Scales

Based on all this info, I came up with some little mnemonic devices of my own.

One is a mnemonic to put the modes in the order in which you add flats, designed to help figure out how to construct the scale:

LIMDAPL ("Limed Apple")

Lydian - one sharp
Ionian - zero sharps, zero flats
Myxolydian - One flat
Dorian - Two flats
Aeolian - Three flats
Phrygian - Four flats
Locrian - Five flats.

The second mnemonic tells me which notes are altered, which is the other piece of information you need to construct the scale. It's a phone number.

407-3625

Sharp 4, no sharps or flats, flat 3, flat 6, flat 2, flat 5, in that order.



Let's say I want to play phrygian...

l i m d a P l
407 3625

I ignore the first two digits of the phone number (obviously) and get a flat 7, 3, 6 and 2. Done.

Works for me...probably because I made it up.

 

[SteveB]

There are no stupid questions. Well, there are, but I don't think this is one of them.

I understand the idea behind modes and the definition of them. What has never been explained is a simple thing about naming them.

Say you've got C major.

C-D-E-F-G-A-B

The aeolian mode of C major starts on the 6th degree of the scale, which is A. This of course yields A minor

A-B-C-D-E-F-G

Here's the question:

Is that called C Aeolian or A Aeolian?

The basic definition of modes doesn't give you that information, and you can look at it either way:

- The scale starting on the sixth note of C major is C Aeolian...the mode taking the name of the parent scale, or
- The scale starting on the sixth note of C major is A Aeolian...the mode taking the name of the root of the new scale

Which is it?

TIA....

I'd call that A Aeolian, or 'the Aeolian mode of the key of C major". But nobody would know what the heck I was talking about, anyway...

I won't mention the "relative minor key of C major".

Or.. since A Aeolian in the key of C major goes from 'la' to 'la', you could call it "A lala".

 

[savannah_sean]

I guess that means Ionian is "dodo" ...

 

[SteveB]

I guess that means Ionian is "dodo" ...

Haha.. yes, using this nomenclature!