To BP: Product Segmentation Question.

[whitestrat]

Hey BP, I'm just being curious, so this is not a "can you make this please" sort of thread.

I've noticed that by and large across the guitar manufacturing world, there are 2 generic types of solid body guitars. I don't mean bolt-on and set-necks, but rather, flat tops and carve tops. almost everyone has these 2 groupings. From Ibanez to ESP to Gibson to Suhrs, Andersons, etc etc. Even Fender had them at some point in time. I don't mean arch top jazz guitar kinda thing (though those would be cool, but not hot sellers). Hell, even Peavey, when they ripped off the Axis on their Wolfgang, made it a carve top. It seems to be the more "luxurious" sort of model design.

Is there a reason why EBMM doesn't have a carve top model?

Because I'm thinking the Axis with a maple Carve Top is going to be a killer!

 

[roburado]

Well...there was that Bongo guitar prototype. Does that count?

 

[slukather]

Why mess with perfection?!?!?! but really with all the options we have at the moment, there are A LOT, l don't think they could accommodate for people ordering arch tops too. But wait until BP chimes in.

 

[roburado]

Personally, I like the feel of EBMMs the way they are. It just seems like the ergonomics work better--at least for me--than if they were to do a carved top. I like the forearm contours, which might not make it onto a carved top.

 

[Eggman]

Is the carve top just for looks or does it add to the tone of the instrument somehow?

If it is just for looks - it would seem to me that there would be a lot of extra cost in offering another option. If the tone of an EBMM guitar is killer in a flat top - why add an additional costly option.

 

[ScoobySteve]

Personally, I like the feel of EBMMs the way they are. It just seems like the ergonomics work better--at least for me--than if they were to do a carved top. I like the forearm contours, which might not make it onto a carved top.

This.

If anyone can supply me with any empirical evidence to suggest that the "arch top" design offers any higher quality in sound dynamics, or offers anything in that realm, than I'd listen.

For me its two simple things.

1. No need to go fixing what isn't broken.
2. Function OVER form.

#2 is what resonates with me particularly. If Arch Top means no forearm contours then forget it. No thank you.

 

[brasco68]

This is just my take....

Because there are so many other compaines doing carved tops, I think EBMM focuses on areas that are more progressive and unique in the market. Just because all the companies you mentioned offer carved tops, shouldn't mean EBMM does as well....why follow when they can lead. If EBMM followed the design lead of everyone else...the Bongo never would have existed.

I love what BP and crew offer....they are the experts.

 

[whitestrat]

If anyone can supply me with any empirical evidence to suggest that the "arch top" design offers any higher quality in sound dynamics, or offers anything in that realm, than I'd listen.
.
.
.
#2 is what resonates with me particularly. If Arch Top means no forearm contours then forget it. No thank you.

The Axis means no forearm contours by nature. (ignore the Reflex for the time being ya?)

I've played a few carved top guitars. While there is no forearm contour, the carve top does make it more comfortable to play as the bridge is raised.

Furthermore, go read "Beauty Of The Burst". If that book is to be believed, then yes, the carve top does make a significant difference on the way it shapes the tone and sustain of the guitar. But that's just 5% of the whole tone equation.

Anyways, saying that nothing aesthetic makes a difference sort of kills our usual mantra of "that top sucks!"

 

[whitestrat]

Why mess with perfection?!?!?! but really with all the options we have at the moment, there are A LOT, l don't think they could accommodate for people ordering arch tops too. But wait until BP chimes in.

While I do empathise with the myriad problems that come with customisation, there are many companies out there who also offer a gazillion options, yet manage to cover most bases.

Suhr is one such company. You can order ANYTHING from him. from his wide spectrum of standard products (woods AND finishes AND lacquer options) right down to a full custom job. His production is growing hugely day by day to the point I think he personally doen't make that many guitars anymore himself.

PRS also does offer tons of options, including a custom Private Reserve option to have one guitar built completely for you at exhuberant prices.

I think the options bit isn't the only reason why EBMM doesn't do this. There might be more, and I'm curious about it. That's all.

 

[Big Poppa]

why the Suhr plug? His production is not very big but his opinions are

 

[fbecir]

I read somewhere that Gibson made a carved top on the Les Paul because they knew that Fender did not have the tools needed for carving the top. Gibson had a carving machine thus it was just a marketing move, not a players requirement.
I prefer to own a ASS P90 with a silent circuit than "a carved top ASS" without silent circuit.

 

[whitestrat]

why the Suhr plug? His production is not very big but his opinions are

Ah no... Sorry. not plugging for him. I'm not exactly a fan. (don't own a single Suhr, but I do have 6 balls, so you can see where my loyalties are.)

I just thought he's one of the closest direct competitors to EBMM quality, options and pricing. I thought his production was quite sizable? I could be wrong though.

Anyways, how about that carved top question?

 

[slukather]

While I do empathise with the myriad problems that come with customisation, there are many companies out there who also offer a gazillion options, yet manage to cover most bases.

Suhr is one such company. You can order ANYTHING from him. from his wide spectrum of standard products (woods AND finishes AND lacquer options) right down to a full custom job. His production is growing hugely day by day to the point I think he personally doen't make that many guitars anymore himself.

PRS also does offer tons of options, including a custom Private Reserve option to have one guitar built completely for you at exhuberant prices.

I think the options bit isn't the only reason why EBMM doesn't do this. There might be more, and I'm curious about it. That's all.

What l ment was, from what l understand EBMM are at full production, if they add something that means they have to discontinue something else, what do they get rid off?? The guitars are fine the was they are, l can't really see an arch top improving these guitars.

 

[Big Poppa]

A. We are not at full production. I dont know of any major factory that is.

B. Suhr is not a competitor...they are much more boutique

C. WE havent really felt the need to do a carved top. We prototyped a few for JP in the original 'f-1' era. (By the way we are always prototyping for JP.)

D. Carved tops can alter the top only in relation to the thickness of the maple top.

 

[Danserrano]

Hey bp how this for my product segment response.

U make em, I'll buy em. Hehe

k, goin back to my 25th wooo whoooo.....

 

[beej]

U make em, I'll buy em.

Hah, that's the best answer yet. +1.

 

[telemike]

I don't see a "need" for carved tops unless you are competing for PRS style shoppers. I don't see EBMM being a one that follows another popular maker's direction to compete. EBMM models stand on thier own. I guess the EVH models are the only ones that follow the original design with EBMM as Eddie keeps moving from company to company.

Carvin did come out with carved tops to compete in the PRS arena and though they lack the PRS cred they do make fine guitars in thier own right and business model.

 

[Dante]

carved tops usually have sharp edges where normally the arm contour rests. and tend to tilt forward more. to both i say: no thanks. in my not so humble opinion, the most ergonomic guitar ever has already been made.

and carving a maple top adds a level of randomness to how the maple looks and a nigh impossibility to get a decent bookmatch that would seriously piss people off. you wanna pay 500 for a quilt or 1000?

 

[Adamr]

all i can say is . ive played quite a few suhr's recently as i was seriously looking at them .
lets just say i pick my new jp6 up on tuesday. lol.

hehe.

 

[BobMac]

There you are...