Off Topic tube preamp or modeller?throw in your .02

[Chaka5150]

Okay fellow knuckleheads, looking for your .02 on this and let me preface this by saying I am not looking to spark a tube vs. digital debate per se. I have read enough of those kinds of threads on various forums.

To help you tailor your comments bear in mind these are my needs: don't play live or with band; mostly home recording enthusiast (this is big for me) I have mesa 2:90 simul class + 212 rectifier cab--I like to have the option to both record and get great sounds either via micing the cab or direct with a modeller, but prefer to play thru the poweramp/cab when noodling. I already have a presonus recording interface. recently sold my gsp1101. have tried numerous line 6 products in the past…not really sure the pod hd stuff is a real 'revolution' as much as a rehashed product…albeit an improvement. guitars EBMM of course (see signature below) guitar tone/Music likes: EVH in the 90's; many of the 80's 'hair bands'…love high gain stuff ala 5150 (original)

Here are the units I've been considering:
Engl special edition preamp (e570)
AXE FX Ultra/Std…I have been really considering this one!!
Engl Steve Morse head--probably overkill
POD HD rackmount (when released) I go coco for cocopuffs wit rackmounted gear
Eleven Rack? hmm jury out on this one.

Shall we now open pandora's box? I am posting this thread here because we all love EBMM guitars and that is what I'll be playing thru.

Cheers,

 

[paranoid70]

I have a Fender Cyber Twin modelling amp. I really like it.

Here are the pluses: Great clean tone, minimal feedback, don't need tons of pedals (or 9V batteries), consistent sound

Negatives: Distortion doesn't quite have the crunch of nice pedal. Single point failure - if your pedal board goes out you are screwed. (Hasn't happened for a gig yet, but it did go out in rehearsal once).

 

[LawDaddy]

I have a Mesa 20/20 -> Mesa 2x12 cab (sounds real similar to your setup), and gigged extensively with a POD X3 Live through it. The tube amp really livened it up. The downside is you really need to spend time dialing in your settings. I suppose this is true of any modeler. I sure was able to cover a lot of ground in one gig, though.

On my X3 through the Mesa, the Silver Jubilee model has to be the best '80s-era patch, ever. And I was there

I'd like to hear if anyone's upgraded to the HD.

 

[bbake1]

Coming from the Digitech 2112 years ago, to boutique amps, then to building my own Egnator and Metro amp kits in search of tone like EVH, Lynch, etc... I now have the Axe-FX Ultra and cannot see ever going back to tubes. There is just so much more available tone-wise, infinitely customizable, instant patch changing, with real tube feel it just compliments my 25ths that I have become a better player.

 

[Chaka5150]

Coming from the Digitech 2112 years ago, to boutique amps, then to building my own Egnator and Metro amp kits in search of tone like EVH, Lynch, etc... I now have the Axe-FX Ultra and cannot see ever going back to tubes. There is just so much more available tone-wise, infinitely customizable, instant patch changing, with real tube feel it just compliments my 25ths that I have become a better player.

funny you mention digitech 2112…I almost bought a gsp2101 artist locally but it turned out to be a dud. I think if I see one of these old relics around I'll buy one, especially cuz they're cheap like borscht. I had the gsp1101…loved it a first but i eventually found the sounds to be too 'sterile' the Axe FX seems to be the bees knees for modellers but a guy has to sell his left nut to buy one

 

[jbhafner]

I play with both realms, personally. I have a Mk II Spider Valve Head and it's rockin'! When we record I use the direct out in the back and also mic the front of the 4x12 cabinet. We blend the two until we're happy. I also have a POD X3 Live that I use for small gigs. I was in GC last week and played through a HD300 right out of the box. I'm really impressed by it. Line 6 should have waited on the POD X3 and just went with this new HD stuff. I'm super impressed by it at the price point they have it set at. The JP6 with the roasted neck sounded amazing through it.

 

[gtrman66]

I have a Mesa 20/20 -> Mesa 2x12 cab (sounds real similar to your setup), and gigged extensively with a POD X3 Live through it. The tube amp really livened it up. The downside is you really need to spend time dialing in your settings. I suppose this is true of any modeler. I sure was able to cover a lot of ground in one gig, though.

On my X3 through the Mesa, the Silver Jubilee model has to be the best '80s-era patch, ever. And I was there

I'd like to hear if anyone's upgraded to the HD.

Yeah the silver jubilee model is pretty cool...I use that one in my flextone3 most of the time on the gig...with an occasional dual rec tone for the more modern stuff.I'm kinda holding out to see if/when the hd rack comes out.

Coming from the Digitech 2112 years ago, to boutique amps, then to building my own Egnator and Metro amp kits in search of tone like EVH, Lynch, etc... I now have the Axe-FX Ultra and cannot see ever going back to tubes. There is just so much more available tone-wise, infinitely customizable, instant patch changing, with real tube feel it just compliments my 25ths that I have become a better player.

I've heard great things about the axe/fx stuff but never had a chance to try it out personally.I've seen lots of youtube vids with some cool and not-so-cool demos on it.Plus there are some pod vs axe fx vids that might be worth watching.Let us know how the tone search goes for ya

 

[jakedawgwhite88]

mesa vtwin is pretty good

 

[Chaka5150]

I play with both realms, personally. I have a Mk II Spider Valve Head and it's rockin'! When we record I use the direct out in the back and also mic the front of the 4x12 cabinet. We blend the two until we're happy. I also have a POD X3 Live that I use for small gigs. I was in GC last week and played through a HD300 right out of the box. I'm really impressed by it. Line 6 should have waited on the POD X3 and just went with this new HD stuff. I'm super impressed by it at the price point they have it set at. The JP6 with the roasted neck sounded amazing through it.

yeah I popped in the guitar shop the other day and tried out the spider valve…pretty cool indeed. I had a Pod x3 live before my digitech gsp1101. I am curious to try out the line 6 DT50 when one ships to the local stores so i can give it a whirl. the DT50 +Pod HD500 would actually be about equal to the Axe FX purchase and I could have direct recording plus a head to play through…hmmm

 

[bbake1]

It's the never ending search for tone.

 

[threeminutesboy]

mesa vtwin is pretty good

It's what I'm using. My main amp is not at home, so when I need to record or play I use the vTwin for the direct to disc or through a Marshall acoustic amp (with the line output) while at home

 

[metalmarty]

I have been using Roland's VG-series for years now (VG-8, 88 and now the 99). Possibilities are endless, sound is excellent. Real easy for home-use, recording or using live. You can use your favorite guitar to sound like any guitar you want, in any tuning you want. Two different guitars into two different amps, full on effects....all possible. If I had money to burn I would buy the Axe-Fx for the amp-sims though (that thing really sounds STELLAR) and use it with the VG-99 for the guitars. The good thing: the VG-99 is much less expensive then the AxeFx. Great piece of kit!

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tl7HUtuSwl4&feature=related]YouTube - VG-99 V-Guitar (1/4) Overview[/ame]

 

[e.mate]

If you don't play live, I'd go for the AxeFX....versatility and connectivity is the name of the game. Though the Engl is a SUPERB preamp

I use both concepts...main rig is a Marshall JMP-1/Rocktron Intellifex (yeah, sturdy 90s gear) into a Brunetti Rockit hybrid power amp. I just love the tube saturation...and I hate the weight of it

So for quick jams or recordings, I use a Rocktron Chameleon (Greenface) which for me still is the best digital preamp ever made. I tried several Line6 products, and didn't get the hang of one single of their units. There's just something missing in the tone...and the Chameleon has it.

I also had a Digitech ValveFX (little brother of those GSPs) which had insane tone, but was simply unusable in a live situation due the switching gaps of about two or three seconds....but the sound was incredible.

 

[Slingy]

You already have a way to mic your amp and a direct interface for your guitar too. Why not try out as many plug in demos as you can and see if any sparks your interest. If you didnt get the results with Line 6 try the others.

 

[ScoobySteve]

If you're a home recording player/warrior then the modeler is the way to go. The diversity offered in a system like AxeFX or even ElevenRack keeps things interesting and fresh when you're stuck on ideas it keeps your options open.

For me personally, I love my ElevenRack, and for when I play at home, its my recording/noodling rig.

BUT..........

After playing through a buddies 68 100wat Plexi superlead...... I just can't get over real tube saturation. The tones from the ElevenRack and AXEFX are great.... but still.....There's just something about plugging your guitar into an amp that's cranked to 10 and feeling your playing respond to super tasty tube saturation...... Axe-FX gets close, but close is simply not IT! For me, I'd like to have both. The problem with great preamps like in late 60's Marshall's is the lack of a master volume, so without a good isolation cab, or attenuator, its a totally impractical application for playing at home.

Ultimately though... with attenuators becoming so advanced and new isolation cabinets, you can bring almost any rig to reasonable bedroom levels. So my advice is..... play through what you want, and what makes you just giggle with nerdiness. At the end of the day, teh gee-tar aint worth playing unless its on your terms!

 

[beej]

The way I see it, these things come down to two approaches.

If you love your amp, keep it. Perhaps get an attenuator (HotPlate, Faustine, etc.) so you can heat it up a bit at home. Mic it when you want to record. You're done.

Or, go the modeler route. AxeFX is the king, but you certainly have lots of other options including software packages. (I work on demos with GuitarRig, then eventually mic my amp when I'm past the experimentation stage.)

All depends how much time, effort and money you want to spend. People always talk about modelers as being so versatile, but I know for me I only use a handful of tones. I've got those in spades from my existing amp (Guytron), and I can get them at just about any volume range, so I've personally got no need to replace them with anything.

People are never going to agree on which route to take, there are just so many options these days. So ultimately you'll have to decide what works for you.

 

[mikeller]

I am not sure if I could feel comfortable with anything but a good tube amp myself, but have never heard anything but great remarks about the AxeFX. I know your soundman would probably love you for it

Seriously - it comes down to quality. Not long ago I picked up a Boss GT-10 with hopes of having a modeler that I could run straight into the board as a back up in case of problem, but even though it is capable of creating bizillions of good sounds, I could not get one great one out of it. But in fairness, I also did not take the time to completely learn it.

For live work give me the simplicity of a good pedal board and tube amp any day

 

[Roubster]

Yea, its a never ending quest for tone...as well as a never ending market and new development of gear. The biggest problem is usually the source to fund the obsession...otherwise everyone would have everything for different applications. I personally played many years through a Line6 spider and really hated it once I got better and started understanding and learning about different amps and also as my ears developed. I like the feel and warm smooth tone of tubes...and I finally got something relatively decent price for home application without annoying the neighbors and I can probably gig with it in the future. Its very simple and I get a nice smooth distortion/lead tone. I think Vinnie Moore said it quite well in one of his interviews...where he sets one channel and stays on that all night...but he constantly uses the volume knob to get different tones. I use the volume and tone knob on my guitars all the time...they are there for a reason . The Y2D is just magical through my simple set up right now. All I need is amp, guitar, BB Preamp and delay pedal to make me happy. I would love to get an AxeFx though for experimenting and just getting millions of different possibilities...that's also inspirational a lot of the times because everyone needs a change.

 

[Coffeemug]

I'm with Beej...if you really your existing amp go with an attenuator...I've only heard good things about Dr. Z's ones...or get an amp with built-in attenuator such as the Engl Gigmaster or Cornell Plexi.

Another one that currently has my interest is the new Blackstar HT-1...a friend of mine just recently bought one and from the few minutes I was able to spend with it I guess it'd be just great for home playing/recording...the cleans are nice enough and the overdriven tones are amazing...another big plus is that you won't have to rob a bank to get one of these...heck, you'd still have enough money to invest in a modelling preamp like the Pod 2.0

 

[tiki-okc]

Ahhh the elusive search for "the tone". I think I have don't it all over the years and as time has passed the technology available today is amazing. I am mainly a home user/recorder and not much public playing anymore. I have so many SS and tube amps collecting dust it isn't funny. Right now I am doing the 3x live ----> a pair of KRK 8's. The laptop plugged into the live makes it fun but I do agree it can be quite sterile if you are not good at dialing in properly. I am very interested in getting the axe fx but I am also considering getting a engl screamer combo or even a Cornford MK 50.

If someone could tell me this is the best all around combo for clean to metal I would buy that amp today no matter the price. then plug that axe fx into it. Is it that simple?

I have no answers as we all have our own search for tone. Just saying I understand the journey bro.