Vintage vs. Modern

[RitchieDarling]

I was perusing another thread discussing pre-EB vs. post-EB gear.

And the thought occurred to me that I belong to a apparent minority.

No, not "first generation child of Ukrainian immigrants" minority, though that one has presented problems in the past.....

I do not care for, nor desire to have, collect, or acquire, any so-called "vintage" gear. While many vintage guitars are pretty and even good players. To me, it's just so much old wood.

I prefer modern gear over vintage every time.

I also do not care for tube amps. I prefer solid state. I love my Markbass amp more than any other I have owned. And I am glad that I no longer deal with unreliable and noisy tubes.

While I enjoy all my old records, I prefer CDs. And do not believe that records sound better. All the pops and skips, not to mention the low end rumble and high end roll off, are just not my cup of tea.

Over the years, I have been involved in numerous recording sessions. And never one to miss an opportunity to get into the studio, I have spent a good deal of time there. And I have to say, I prefer digital recording using ProTools or Logic Pro hands down over the old analog. I like for my bass to come out of the speakers sounding the same as it went into the computer.

Maybe I am just a techno-geek. I'm fine with that. But, I do wonder how many more out there share my feelings in these areas. You can keep your 70's era basses. I'll play my Dargie Delight!

Ok, make with the opinions, you knuckleheads!

Ritchie

 

[PzoLover]

old man likes new bass

Hey Ritchie,
for the most part, I'm with you ... I'm hoping that my next new bass is a brand spankers BONGO5 '07 LE HSP, and I mostly suspect the word "Vintage", is now, just an excuse for some people to ask , and others , to pay, absolutely stupid, ridiculous prices for otherwise, easily replaceable gear, on the basis that one day, someone was stupid enough to fork over so and so much money for something of a like description
having said that, I'm totally in love with my keeper "starter" bass, my genuine, authentic. original 1981 BCRich Eagle Supreme, which someone may now pay a stupid price for, but that doesn't concern me, since "Ruby"'s not for sale, she's mine for keeps even though she's not easily replaceable, let alone for the sort of price she came to me for, many years ago ... but, she's a stunner, and a great player and with a very powerful, modern, voice and she more than "holds her own against any piece of modern gearfor reasons inherent in her design and construction.


so, I'm happy to play new SR5s and I Gas BIG for a new BONGO5 ... SOON
What the heck, who am I to talk ... at my age and in my condition I'm a "Vintage" Bass Player, more than a player or buyer of "Vintage" bass gear
All The Bass,
/PL

 

[kdphysio]

"Vintage", is now, just an excuse for some people to ask , and others , to pay, absolutely stupid, ridiculous prices for otherwise, easily replaceable gear

++++1

It's been happening with F****r for years!

 

[Duarte]

I agree with you 100% on the digital recording gear - our school just bought a whole fleet af macs for the studios, SO much better to use than the 4/8/16 track analoque things. Logic Pro is just amazing.

And it never fails to impress me whenever I plug in the stingray, just how good it sounds.

 

[Trix]

For me, it doesn't matter if it's vintage or modern. The instrument should play well and sound good.
New technology will usually afford advances in the performace of a given source. What you like is what you like.
P.S. I will take any headache that tubes might present, and in the future I promise not to post after consuming too many adult beverages.

rcgtrix - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting

 

[Randracula]

I agree with you concerning guitars/basses. I agree that digital recording has made it much easier for bands to record their own music but there's still something(warmth) I miss about 2" tape. As far as amps go, I believe all tube amps sound great for some styles of music and will treat you as well as you treat them.I currently own Markbass(CMD102P),GK(1001RBII) and an SVT Classic and I think they all sound great.I don't think tube amps are as noisy and unreliable as you think or Markbass wouldn't have bothered to make one.....

 

[Slapfest]

I will try and behave myself, here.
My participation in these type of threads has not always been received well.

Firstly, let me say from the start, that whatever any individual prefers the sound of, is a matter of personal taste. Thank god we dont all like the same things, otherwise there would be no variation.
So I get uncomfortable with those types that proclaim that "this player is the best" or "this brand is the best".... it is all subjective, and THATS the beauty of it!
Whatever bass, amp, string, car or boat that you love, doesnt matter.....if it is inspiring YOU, thats the important thing.
When it comes to instruments....if you love your instrument, and it is helping you to bring out your best, then who cares what anyone else thinks or says about your choice?
And if your playing moves other people to applaud or compliment you, it's YOUR PLAYING, not your equipment, that has captured them.
Whether the hardware is new or old, these things are our tools. and if you play badly, no amount of great equipment will really help.
We all have our own preferences.
I have owned and played many amps and basses.
old school vintage, new shool hi-tech (and really, really expensive) models..... and all points in between.... and when it comes to basses, I went right around the whole block untill I realised that the bass that I played for 20 years previously, was the one that most suited MY taste.
(time to 'come out of the closet', i guess)
Yes, folks...I do admit it.... I play a '76 Stingray .... and I love it
Wouldnt trade it for anything ...... and my enthusiasm for these basses has inspired me and helped me to practice longer and made me a better player.
But thats just me.
Everyone else will have their own particular preference, and I completely respect that. ( and I wish that attitude was a little more prevalent here, at times)
Who cares what anyone else thinks about brands, types etc...
The main idea is that we please ourselves, and choose accordingly.
Sometimes we seem to get bogged down in the details, and in trying to wave our individual flags in each other's faces.
Who cares?....they are simply our tools of the trade....in making music.
and in my opinion, its the music you make that defines you as a musician, not your hardware.

 

[kdphysio]

I will try and behave myself, here.
My participation in these type of threads has not always been received well.

Well, you've surpassed yourself then, because that's very well put!

As i've said on another thread re heavy/light basses - which is best?.....Beauty is in the eye of the beholder, because it's all too subjective, unless you are a lemming, and just follow the perceived 'in-crowd'.

 

[Kirby]

I agree with you mostly Ritchie, but I love the sounds of old tube pre-amps. Don't get me wrong, I currently own an LMKII and a GK1001RB combo and love each of them for their distinct sound. However, I dearly love my two older Demeter VTBP-201's with Mullards in them. That sound just cannot be beat no matter what plugs into them.

As far as basses, I am constantly amazed by what is available to today's player as opposed to some 24 years ago when I started playing. Players today have a great advantage and the beginner instruments are miles above what I could have purchased in the early 80's on my budget then.

 

[RitchieDarling]

I should probably clarify the tube amp thing.

I do like the sound of a tube amp. I simply like solid state better.

And the tube amps we have today are much more reliable and quiet than the ones in the past.

I had an SVT 4 Pro and it sounded great!

However, having said all that, I still prefer solid state.

My beef really is more with the tube amps we had back in the 70's - 80's

You know, VINTAGE gear....

I have a pal who swears by his old Kustom tube bass amp.

And it sounds ok. Until it gets too hot and starts to crackle and cut out...

Which is usually after about 1½ hours of play. Makes gigging a real adventure...

But these are all great opinions! Keep 'em coming!

Ritchie

 

[Big Poppa]

I will try and behave myself, here.
My participation in these type of threads has not always been received well.

Firstly, let me say from the start, that whatever any individual prefers the sound of, is a matter of personal taste. Thank god we dont all like the same things, otherwise there would be no variation.
So I get uncomfortable with those types that proclaim that "this player is the best" or "this brand is the best".... it is all subjective, and THATS the beauty of it!
Whatever bass, amp, string, car or boat that you love, doesnt matter.....if it is inspiring YOU, thats the important thing.
When it comes to instruments....if you love your instrument, and it is helping you to bring out your best, then who cares what anyone else thinks or says about your choice?
And if your playing moves other people to applaud or compliment you, it's YOUR PLAYING, not your equipment, that has captured them.
Whether the hardware is new or old, these things are our tools. and if you play badly, no amount of great equipment will really help.
We all have our own preferences.
I have owned and played many amps and basses.
old school vintage, new shool hi-tech (and really, really expensive) models..... and all points in between.... and when it comes to basses, I went right around the whole block untill I realised that the bass that I played for 20 years previously, was the one that most suited MY taste.
(time to 'come out of the closet', i guess)
Yes, folks...I do admit it.... I play a '76 Stingray .... and I love it
Wouldnt trade it for anything ...... and my enthusiasm for these basses has inspired me and helped me to practice longer and made me a better player.
But thats just me.
Everyone else will have their own particular preference, and I completely respect that. ( and I wish that attitude was a little more prevalent here, at times)
Who cares what anyone else thinks about brands, types etc...
The main idea is that we please ourselves, and choose accordingly.
Sometimes we seem to get bogged down in the details, and in trying to wave our individual flags in each other's faces.
Who cares?....they are simply our tools of the trade....in making music.
and in my opinion, its the music you make that defines you as a musician, not your hardware.

Slapfest....actually the people that usually state that they wish there was more tolerance are the ones least flexible...... I am not accusing you of this but sometimes the forum gets blamed when to thread is faulty.They key in any of these threads is Ritchie went out of his way stating his opinions and preferences. He asked what others felt of the subject. WHere we get into trouble is when posters do not allow for another opinion or attack anothers. If you dont like a thread usually it is the poster that started by either forcing his or her opinion on others or not allowing another viewpoint.

Now Ritchie..I like tube guitar amps old stuff.... Love em....I love old tube heads fdor bass but I really love Mark bass. I dont know anything about recording these days other than buying stuff that I never get around to using....It is always my new years resolution to make a record.

I love my 57 P Bass my dad gave me but I dont know where it is....I love my proto Stingray that leo gave me....I dont know where that is either. I have some plastic knob mm's that I also dont know where they are. I love BOngo's and Sterlings......

thank god Dudley does!

 

[RitchieDarling]

Well said, BP!

It's all a matter of personal preference.

All opinions are welcome and valid.

R

 

[Slapfest]

BP, Ritchie....no offence intended.

I wasnt actually meaning to criticise ritchie at all...although in hindsight it does look a bit like that.

I was anticipating a huge wave of anti pre-eb sentiment that usually follows in these situations.
I have been told on several occasions to " stay between the lines" for expressing opinions based on my personal experience.
That was all I was referring to.
I have a lot of admiration and respect for the tremendous service and resource that has been created here. And I apologise if I was out of line.
I was probably hijacking the thread slightly by stating my belief on how personal these choices are, but your right, I should just have left it alone.
I wasnt meaning to squash anyones opinion or attack anyone, in fact, the whole jist of what I was saying was that there ARE no bad choices, if its working for you.

Anyway, I guess my hot spots are also

vintage tube amps
my 'late '76 Stingray
and I absolutely loved B001013 for 20 years. It was the best. (for me, anyway)

 

[T-bone]

Great thread, Richie!

I don't have a lot of "vintage" gear, but what I have other people seem to like and borrow for recording. That 63 1/2 Fender Deluxe is a favorite amongst many of my friends (probably because I put a Musicman speaker in it 10 years ago). However, I seem to fall more in your camp.

First, I've spent my entire career (same age as BP) in the computer industry. So I'm fairly confident when I say technology is more advanced today, than, say, 30 - 40 years ago.

And Second, it has been said "they don't build em like they used to" to which I respond, "it's a damn good thing." Because of codes, standards (ISO), etc...they build em better. I don't know long it has been since I've been shocked by a mic, but I do know it's because everything is grounded now. Simple, huh.

With regard to recording - that's a different beast for me. I love Pro-tools and how easy it is to record now. I especially love that if I'm not "dead on" with the kick, the recording engineer can just line it up for me. However, it does seem to make it a bit more sterile, and it doesn't force me to be a better player.

Finally, as a CD replicator, I much prefer CD's over vinyl or tape. MP3's however, have gone too far (don't get me started).

tbone

 

[oddjob]

I have had some wonderful vintage gear... and some that was worthless. To me it was about getting the sound. I am an '80s child (actually born in 70 but started the whole music thing in 80) - I love the bass sound, so solid state doesn't phase me at all (my all time fav was when I had my GK800 and Kubicki ExFactor - screamed 80s). I have had a decent older Ray, played my friend '77 Ray quite a bit, sold a 69 Fndr... it sounded cool but it isn't what I have today.

The Bongo and my GK are what I am looking for (and I guess have been for some time).
I sometimes think back to what I had and sniff a bit, but only for a bit... I don't miss my 400 lbs bass stack (2 Peavey 18x20s (150 each) and a Sunn head (I kind of miss that but the tone was off and on)).

 

[danomar]

I am amused by a similar sort of thread that pops up on TB every once in a while. I was completely stoked when solid-state amplifiers became viable way back when because they are generally lighter, more efficient, and easier to maintain than tube amps. Then again, some tube amps sound great. I still can't wrap my proverbial head around the love for vintage sound gear, but I appreciate it.

I have a late '70's Stingray that I love, but it's just a bass. I played a Bongo for the first time a few weeks ago and now I want one. My 1967 Rickenbacker 4005 will be sold only when I can no longer play it. Same for my 30th Anniversary Stingray.

Good stuff old and new. I like some vintage stuff just because I could not afford it when I was young. I think new EBMM instruments are better in nearly every way than pre-EBMM, but that said, I sometimes like things that don't work perfectly. Like my vintage Italian motorcycles...

 

[Dr Stankface]

I like my gear. Vintage shmintage.

 

[bovinehost]

Some old stuff is fun.
Some old stuff is hateful.

Some old stuff sounds good!
Some old stuff sounds like doo-doo.

Some old stuff feels great in your hands!
Some old stuff feels weird and creaky.

Some old stuff works better than it ever did.
Some old stuff is falling apart.

I'm old - and I think all of those things apply to me.

 

[RitchieDarling]

Some old stuff is fun.
Some old stuff is hateful.

Some old stuff sounds good!
Some old stuff sounds like doo-doo.

Some old stuff feels great in your hands!
Some old stuff feels weird and creaky.

Some old stuff works better than it ever did.
Some old stuff is falling apart.

I'm old - and I think all of those things apply to me.

+1

 

[Baird]

I sold all of my vintage gear EXCEPT my 1974 P bass. An old P (if you get a good one) with flats does classic blues/rock better than ANY current bass available IMO. Again, just my opinion.

I personally LIKE the warmer tube amp sound, but I LOVE being able to show up to a gig or practice with only a gig bag that fits my Markbass F1 and bass. The weight/price decision was more important that a tiny bit of a warmer sound. I am NEVER carrying around an 80lb head again. I just have no interest in doing that.

I play modern rock and funk mostly these days and IMO I NEED a Stingray or similar MODERN (and active) bass. Again, just me. I have friends that have the same RICs, Fenders and even Pre-EB SRs they have owned since the early 80's. Same Ampeg and Fender amps and cabs too. Those things are paid for 10 times over and they are only a couple of gigs a month cover band guys like me!

Buy and play what you like. There is no right or wrong here IMO.