leftyguitarblue
Well-known member
I actually cut out a spot on the backplate so the screws stay untouchable, but accessible.
- Thread starter the24thfret
- Start date
I actually cut out a spot on the backplate so the screws stay untouchable, but accessible.
the24thfret
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- Joined
- Jan 4, 2007
- Messages
- 2,458
the24thfret
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2007
- Messages
- 2,458
really? ill be looking there, then. thanks rossie.
Right on! Thank you "search"! I go to dropped D a lot, and I'm just miserable because of the float on my Luke and my JP's. Looks like I'll be ordering three of these things tomorrow! Errr.. maybe not... looks like they are getting ready to launch two new models.. so I might wait and see what those are all about first!
Also, my band is in Eb and when I record, I usually record in E, so retuning is a major pain. Plus, when learning new songs or jamming, often times songs are in E. So, I think this thing is answer to my prayers!
Thanks guys!
J
Also, my band is in Eb and when I record, I usually record in E, so retuning is a major pain. Plus, when learning new songs or jamming, often times songs are in E. So, I think this thing is answer to my prayers!
Thanks guys!
J
BigTony
Well-known member
Yummy! I'll be getting one too!!
the24thfret
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- Jan 4, 2007
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installed!
I finally installed the Tremel-no in my JP6, so I took a few pictures which may give other JP users an idea of the fitment:
So I've only been using this for a day, and I haven't yet found the sweet spot on it. I'm by no means a pro on this thing yet, and I think it will take a while and a lot of getting used to. It's currently providing a bit of extra tension on the movement of the trem, and I can feel friction although not much. As you can see, the piece is essentially two metal parts, one the new claw and metal shaft, and the other the screws on the piece which attach to the bottom of the trem block. There is a third piece called the Deep-C, the top screw piece, but this is free-moving.
So because the Tremel-no is a metal shaft freely moving through a cylinder when you move the bridge around, there is bound to be extra tension I think due to friction inside the unit. If the two pieces aren't PERFECTLY lined up, the trem feels absolutely terrible. It takes a hell of a lot of patience. Or maybe I'm just impatient!
The JP apparently requires use of the provided 2mm spacer (1mm also included). I found that the trem worked best with that spacer in than without it or with the 1mm. Anyone else find this too?
Install took me about an hour with the downloaded video only because I tried both spacers and really had to move things around a lot to find the best positioning, although I don't think I've totally found the sweet spot yet where there is no friction. I essentially installed the thing 5 times to figure everything out the best I could.
There are about a million ways to adjust the thing, and it definitely complicates trem use in a lot of ways, although it simplifies it in others. Build quality appears to be excellent, though, which is comforting.
I can already see many ways to improve the piece, but these would necessitate further complicating it, and it may be even more of a pain in the ass!
My review as of 24 hours is "very good." Pros is that it holds the trem strongly when locked in, and the guitar can be thrown into any tuning, and the "dive-only" mode is pretty awesome. Cons at this point include it not coming perfectly back into tune after locking, de-tuning, dive-only mode engaging, full re-locking, retuning, and returning to passive full-floating mode. It's a bit out. The other con is the added tension/friction in the trem which is small but I can't seem to get rid of completely.
I also need to lube my nut, I think that may help tuning stability somewhat.
If anyone wants more information or detailed photos, let me know! I'm going to mess with it more!
I finally installed the Tremel-no in my JP6, so I took a few pictures which may give other JP users an idea of the fitment:
So I've only been using this for a day, and I haven't yet found the sweet spot on it. I'm by no means a pro on this thing yet, and I think it will take a while and a lot of getting used to. It's currently providing a bit of extra tension on the movement of the trem, and I can feel friction although not much. As you can see, the piece is essentially two metal parts, one the new claw and metal shaft, and the other the screws on the piece which attach to the bottom of the trem block. There is a third piece called the Deep-C, the top screw piece, but this is free-moving.
So because the Tremel-no is a metal shaft freely moving through a cylinder when you move the bridge around, there is bound to be extra tension I think due to friction inside the unit. If the two pieces aren't PERFECTLY lined up, the trem feels absolutely terrible. It takes a hell of a lot of patience. Or maybe I'm just impatient!
The JP apparently requires use of the provided 2mm spacer (1mm also included). I found that the trem worked best with that spacer in than without it or with the 1mm. Anyone else find this too?
Install took me about an hour with the downloaded video only because I tried both spacers and really had to move things around a lot to find the best positioning, although I don't think I've totally found the sweet spot yet where there is no friction. I essentially installed the thing 5 times to figure everything out the best I could.
There are about a million ways to adjust the thing, and it definitely complicates trem use in a lot of ways, although it simplifies it in others. Build quality appears to be excellent, though, which is comforting.
I can already see many ways to improve the piece, but these would necessitate further complicating it, and it may be even more of a pain in the ass!
My review as of 24 hours is "very good." Pros is that it holds the trem strongly when locked in, and the guitar can be thrown into any tuning, and the "dive-only" mode is pretty awesome. Cons at this point include it not coming perfectly back into tune after locking, de-tuning, dive-only mode engaging, full re-locking, retuning, and returning to passive full-floating mode. It's a bit out. The other con is the added tension/friction in the trem which is small but I can't seem to get rid of completely.
I also need to lube my nut, I think that may help tuning stability somewhat.
If anyone wants more information or detailed photos, let me know! I'm going to mess with it more!
the24thfret
Well-known member
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2007
- Messages
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I wanted to add two more pictures... and notice the not-so-strategically placed Line6 POD...
This is the back of the guitar (with the plate off) and the screws tightened fully (fully locked bridge)... you can see they stick out just a bit as does the end of the unit even more (I'm using a 2mm spacer)...
This is the back of the guitar with the screws loose by about 2-3 turns (the trem is fully floating). You can see they are clearly further out and would catch on clothing or a belt or something. The end of the unit still sticks out.
Just wanted to post because I was unaware of any similar pictures out there... hopefully this helps some of you JP and soon-to-be Tremol-no owners!
This is the back of the guitar (with the plate off) and the screws tightened fully (fully locked bridge)... you can see they stick out just a bit as does the end of the unit even more (I'm using a 2mm spacer)...
This is the back of the guitar with the screws loose by about 2-3 turns (the trem is fully floating). You can see they are clearly further out and would catch on clothing or a belt or something. The end of the unit still sticks out.
Just wanted to post because I was unaware of any similar pictures out there... hopefully this helps some of you JP and soon-to-be Tremol-no owners!
BigTony
Well-known member
Thanks for the pics. I am deffinatly in 2 minds now whether to get one. Im not sure I like the bits sticking out of the back. Also the bit about the additional friction.
Please keep us updated. Most new things are a little off putting at first, (apart from a new Ball ofcourse!), let us know how you get on with it.
Please keep us updated. Most new things are a little off putting at first, (apart from a new Ball ofcourse!), let us know how you get on with it.
jazzbo jim
Well-known member
you won't be sorry...I bought 3! (not 3 factorial BTW
) One for each ball.Now I can float, dive and hard tail! Yipee!
the24thfret
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- Joined
- Jan 4, 2007
- Messages
- 2,458
I'll keep you guys updated, I hope to play around with it more this weekend.
It is hard to get a feel for now. I think getting used to a floating trem years ago took me a long time, and this is like a whole new trem, at least that is how I feel about it. The adjustments I was able to make to the trem before (turning the claw screws, etc) are now complicated because the tremel-no has to be perfectly aligned. Like I said it feels like a hassle now, although it works.
Back to the JP!
the24thfret
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- Joined
- Jan 4, 2007
- Messages
- 2,458
Update!
UPDATE!
Hey everyone, I've had the Tremol-no for something like 6 weeks on my JP now and am ready to give a better assessment of it's performance, and hopefully more information for all of you potential buyers.
FIRST, my overriding impression is a good one. Thumbs up! The Tremol-no generally does what it says it will do and works pretty well. If you want your full-floating guitar to also become a hard tail on the fly, this is the gadget for you.
SECOND, the most important point next to the first -- Installing a Tremol-no will not make your Tremolo more simple to use in any way. I can't stress this enough... installing the Tremol-no will only complicate tremolo usage and setup! Getting the thing to work properly has taken me a lot of time and a bit of frustration -- "Why won't the trem work the same as it used to!!!" etc -- but once setup perfectly the tremolo now has new capabilities and therein is much more versatile.
Now onto the details...
TREMOLO FEEL
The Tremol-no, as I've said and shown, is meant to be passive and unobtrusive to tremolo use when not locked. This, however, we know would next to impossible as the system is still installed when not engaged. The Tremol-no is there even when you don't need it, and it will therefore change the feel of your tremolo somewhat. Not to mention, you replace the original claw with the Tremol-no claw, so it's not an original trem system anymore.
And this is your main fear, that when installing this thing it will change the feel of your tremolo. Well, I'm sorry, but it does. It has to. No matter how perfectly the Tremol-no is set up, the tremolo will feel different. For me, it feels a tiny, tiny bit tighter. There is a tiny bit of added resistance. If the Tremol-no is slightly, slightly angled or not perfectly calibrated, the tremolo will have a pretty serious metal-on-metal grinding feel to it. More on this in a bit.
Granted, if it is set up perfectly, the Tremol-no makes the floating tremolo feel only slightly different than the original, from-the-factory setup, but still feels good. I would not say it feels as good as the original factory setup.
So this necessitates attention at all times to the feel of the tremolo and the function of the Tremol-no.
One example comes to mind when I think of the feel of the Tremol-no'd tremolo and the original feel: the whammy "flutter". Slamming the bar properly on the guitar now still flutters as it did originally, but I think it flutters less. It's a less impressive sound. On the original JP bridge/trem setup, I could slam the thing and it had this beautiful flutter sound. The sound is still there but isn't nearly as perfect sounding. It doesn't flutter as much. And I attribute this to the slightly, slightly added tension in the movement of the tremolo due to the installation of the Tremol-no.
Another example is trem use, when the Tremol-no is not perfectly set up, will cause enough noise to trip a noise gate. This is if there is friction in the tremolo. This friction will cause enough sound to trip a noise gate even when strings are silenced. This isn't really an issue for me, but can be if you don't maintain the perfect function of the Tremol-no.
MORE OPTIONS = MORE COMPLICATED
If you used to play Floyd Rose tremolos and converted to the JP, like I did, you understand how much better the JP bridge is and how, without locking nuts and the like, the JP trem is more stable and feels easier to set up and just generally works better.
Whereas with my purchase of the JP I felt my tremolo use was simplified, it has again been complicated by the Tremol-no.
The Tremol-no has 3 thumbscrews, 3 super-small allen screws (2 different sizes), and it's own claw, which replaces the factory one. There is also a choice of 2 sized spacers which are necessary to fit the JP trem cavity. The receiving end of the Tremol-no, which clamps to the bottom of the trem block, also has a joint to allow it to set to the proper angle. So you can see there is a lot of adjustments to be made on the thing, and, combined with the wood screws through the claw and all the other factory trem adjustments, complicates setup of the trem.
I found that when set up properly, the thing holds just fine. It works well.
But getting it set up properly takes a while. If you change gauges of strings at all, or even brands, this is going to make set up a pain in the ass. Something complicated for most hard-tail players or floating trem newbies, such as adjusting the claw screws for bridge height in the cavity, is pretty complicated with the Tremol-no. It'd be something like this... get new strings on, check height, unlock Tremol-no claw, adjust claw screws, lock Tremol-no claw, tune strings, check, and repeat. It adds a significant amount of time to a setup, and a bit of frustration.
If you're a trem newbie, give up. You need to know your way around a floating tremolo very well.
The main difficultly -- or the main thing to get juuuust right -- when you set up a guitar with the Tremol-no is the alignment of the two parts of the unit. It is a metal bar with fits inside a receiver. Because the bar moves in and out of the receiver when in normal tremolo mode, it is essential that this is a frictionless as possible (NB: this is where any friction feeling in the trem comes from). So you need the two parts to be perfectly aligned.
So as we know, you adjust the trem claw screws individually to control the tension of the springs. But with the Tremol-no, the screws need to be perfectly, exactly lined up with the trem block. Essentially you have two parallel lines, | = | (that's a visual representation), and in between you have a metal bar. If the trem screws are slightly different and put the claw slightly at an angle, you get ( \ = | ) or ( / = | ) . This makes the bar in the receiver grind, and gives grinding tension to the tremolo. You can seriously feel this in the whammy bar. So you must make tiny, minute adjustments to each trem claw screw to both a) adjust the height of the bridge like normal and now b) keep the claw and trem block perfectly aligned, | = | .
So where once the two screws' unequal tension or length didn't matter, now it matters! I find the best way to get it aligned is ignore the Tremol-no initially. Focus on the height of the trem. Get it about where you want it (though maybe a bit higher, see section below for the reason) and THEN adjust only ONE claw screw while pulling up and down on the whammy bar, feeling carefully for tension. When the one screw you are adjusting comes aligned with the other, you'll feel a significant decrease in the tension on the whammy/bridge. That's the sweet spot. Leave it. To do this, I literally have one hand, my right, behind the guitar with a screwdriver adjusting the one claw screw and my left hand pulling the whammy bar in and out.
ONE PROBLEM
The Tremol-no has one issue that I haven't been able to resolve or avoid. Other Tremol-no owners can let me know if they find this issue as well.
This is also a bit hard to explain, so bear with me please.
If you look in the previously posted pictures, you can see there are two small allen screws on the top of the Tremol-no claw. These tighten down on the trem wood screws to secure it. Seeing as the original claw has no such locking mechanism, I assume this is to prevent any movement of the claw across the screws, but I don't fully understand why it is necessary. In my opinion, wouldn't the tension in the springs keep the claw flush at the end of the screws?
Regardless, these screws, when loose, hold the claw in a slightly different angle then when they are tightened. So when tightened, the Tremol-no pulls slightly on the trem springs. The tightening of the locking screws push on the claw.
The effect of this is troublesome during a set up. Because you need to have these locking screws loosened to adjust the trem claw screws, you then need to lock them to see the actual tremolo height in the cavity. And when you lock them, you increase the tension, and the bridge dips.
So what you have here is the inability to visually set the proper height of the trem (angle in the cavity I mean, to keep it level). Because if the strings are in tune but the bridge is a bit high, you will tighten the claw screws so the bridge sits a bit lower. Then, you retune the strings because they have gone sharp due to the increased tension in the springs. Assuming they get in tune just as the bridge goes level, normally you are fine. The bridge is set up just fine. But with the Tremol-no, you then need to lock these tiny screws on the trem claw screws, and by doing so it pulls more on the springs. So your bridge dips more, and the strings go sharp, and when you retune the bridge is sitting too low.
You can see the problem here; it's a kind of Catch 22. The Tremol-no can't be used without the locking screws set. But you can't adjust the claw screws without unlocking the locking screws. Because the tension between locked and unlocked is different, the guitar can't be adjusted in the state it will eventually take...
Sorry it's difficult to explain. But this requires the kind of "guess work" as to the effect of the locking screws on the tension of the bridge. I find myself setting the trem a bit higher when working on the trem claw screws, then locking the locking screws on the trem screws and I find it pulls it enough to have the trem around perfect level.
"DEEP-C" PROBLEM
The Tremol-no has two locking abilities, one to fully lock the trem, which works great with two thumb screws, and another to put the bridge in "dive-only" mode with one thumb screw.
I have not, in nearly 2 months of use, been able to get the guitar to stay in tune in "dive-only" mode. The trem goes down, comes back, and the guitar is out of tune.
Therefore I don't use "dive-only" mode and consider it useless.
I don't know what the problem is, although I can only imagine it is either the single thumb screw lacking enough clamping power to stay still OR it is the design of the unit, which necessitates full locking (with two thumb screws) before locking the "Deep-C" screw and then unlocking the two original screws to leave the "Deep-C" by itself. I think the two are not able to function apart.
Again, this is hard to describe, but suffice to say the guitar won't stay in tune with in "dive-only" mode.
TUNING ISSUES
Aside from the "dive-only" tuning problems, I find that when properly set up, the guitar can switch from locked trem mode to full-flating mode without a need for a retune. Still, I find myself checking the tuning lot more often and sometimes wishing I didn't have to. Occasionally the guitar isn't as stable as it used to be.
SPECIFICS to the JP
I find the JP can fit the Tremol-no with the small spacer provided. The thumb screws and receiver clamp (on the bottom of the trem block) stick out just slightly from the back of the guitar (see previously posted pictures, although those were taken with the larger spacer). Cutting holes in the trem plate is necessary not only for access to the screws (the reason you bought the Tremol-no in the first place, so you need access) but also because the cover will no longer fit on. Thankfully, the JP trem cover is of substantial thickness and I PREDICT even with holes in it it will protect the trem parts from my shirt, belt, or buttons while playing. Without a trem plate I find that I can sometimes catch my clothes on the Tremol-no.
I'm currently hacking my original trem-plate to bits, so I'll hopefully fill you all in on that later.
CONCLUSIONS
The Tremol-no is a great device which has added a ton of versatility to my guitar.
I use the locking mechanism not only for alternate tunings, but also for blues (to prevent flat notes while bending and hitting another note) and also acoustic riffing (I find a steady bridge sounds better).
The Tremol-no is NOT for newbies. If you can't set up your own guitar fully, don't think you can manage a Tremol-no. You need to know virtually all the working parts of your guitar to troubleshoot what eventually may become a headache.
Also, the Tremol-no will alter the feel of your guitar, for better or for worse. I'll put this another way... if you like the guitar you have now as it is and don't want to change it, don't. The Tremol-no changed my JP for better in some ways and worse in some others. The trem is the same but different in some ways.
So, really, it's a tradeoff: Trade a bit of feel in the trem and some frustration during setup for a lot of new tuning options and potentially some convenience at some points.
I hope this little review helps some of the Tremol-no hopefuls out there!
UPDATE!
Hey everyone, I've had the Tremol-no for something like 6 weeks on my JP now and am ready to give a better assessment of it's performance, and hopefully more information for all of you potential buyers.
FIRST, my overriding impression is a good one. Thumbs up! The Tremol-no generally does what it says it will do and works pretty well. If you want your full-floating guitar to also become a hard tail on the fly, this is the gadget for you.
SECOND, the most important point next to the first -- Installing a Tremol-no will not make your Tremolo more simple to use in any way. I can't stress this enough... installing the Tremol-no will only complicate tremolo usage and setup! Getting the thing to work properly has taken me a lot of time and a bit of frustration -- "Why won't the trem work the same as it used to!!!" etc -- but once setup perfectly the tremolo now has new capabilities and therein is much more versatile.
Now onto the details...
TREMOLO FEEL
The Tremol-no, as I've said and shown, is meant to be passive and unobtrusive to tremolo use when not locked. This, however, we know would next to impossible as the system is still installed when not engaged. The Tremol-no is there even when you don't need it, and it will therefore change the feel of your tremolo somewhat. Not to mention, you replace the original claw with the Tremol-no claw, so it's not an original trem system anymore.
And this is your main fear, that when installing this thing it will change the feel of your tremolo. Well, I'm sorry, but it does. It has to. No matter how perfectly the Tremol-no is set up, the tremolo will feel different. For me, it feels a tiny, tiny bit tighter. There is a tiny bit of added resistance. If the Tremol-no is slightly, slightly angled or not perfectly calibrated, the tremolo will have a pretty serious metal-on-metal grinding feel to it. More on this in a bit.
Granted, if it is set up perfectly, the Tremol-no makes the floating tremolo feel only slightly different than the original, from-the-factory setup, but still feels good. I would not say it feels as good as the original factory setup.
So this necessitates attention at all times to the feel of the tremolo and the function of the Tremol-no.
One example comes to mind when I think of the feel of the Tremol-no'd tremolo and the original feel: the whammy "flutter". Slamming the bar properly on the guitar now still flutters as it did originally, but I think it flutters less. It's a less impressive sound. On the original JP bridge/trem setup, I could slam the thing and it had this beautiful flutter sound. The sound is still there but isn't nearly as perfect sounding. It doesn't flutter as much. And I attribute this to the slightly, slightly added tension in the movement of the tremolo due to the installation of the Tremol-no.
Another example is trem use, when the Tremol-no is not perfectly set up, will cause enough noise to trip a noise gate. This is if there is friction in the tremolo. This friction will cause enough sound to trip a noise gate even when strings are silenced. This isn't really an issue for me, but can be if you don't maintain the perfect function of the Tremol-no.
MORE OPTIONS = MORE COMPLICATED
If you used to play Floyd Rose tremolos and converted to the JP, like I did, you understand how much better the JP bridge is and how, without locking nuts and the like, the JP trem is more stable and feels easier to set up and just generally works better.
Whereas with my purchase of the JP I felt my tremolo use was simplified, it has again been complicated by the Tremol-no.
The Tremol-no has 3 thumbscrews, 3 super-small allen screws (2 different sizes), and it's own claw, which replaces the factory one. There is also a choice of 2 sized spacers which are necessary to fit the JP trem cavity. The receiving end of the Tremol-no, which clamps to the bottom of the trem block, also has a joint to allow it to set to the proper angle. So you can see there is a lot of adjustments to be made on the thing, and, combined with the wood screws through the claw and all the other factory trem adjustments, complicates setup of the trem.
I found that when set up properly, the thing holds just fine. It works well.
But getting it set up properly takes a while. If you change gauges of strings at all, or even brands, this is going to make set up a pain in the ass. Something complicated for most hard-tail players or floating trem newbies, such as adjusting the claw screws for bridge height in the cavity, is pretty complicated with the Tremol-no. It'd be something like this... get new strings on, check height, unlock Tremol-no claw, adjust claw screws, lock Tremol-no claw, tune strings, check, and repeat. It adds a significant amount of time to a setup, and a bit of frustration.
If you're a trem newbie, give up. You need to know your way around a floating tremolo very well.
The main difficultly -- or the main thing to get juuuust right -- when you set up a guitar with the Tremol-no is the alignment of the two parts of the unit. It is a metal bar with fits inside a receiver. Because the bar moves in and out of the receiver when in normal tremolo mode, it is essential that this is a frictionless as possible (NB: this is where any friction feeling in the trem comes from). So you need the two parts to be perfectly aligned.
So as we know, you adjust the trem claw screws individually to control the tension of the springs. But with the Tremol-no, the screws need to be perfectly, exactly lined up with the trem block. Essentially you have two parallel lines, | = | (that's a visual representation), and in between you have a metal bar. If the trem screws are slightly different and put the claw slightly at an angle, you get ( \ = | ) or ( / = | ) . This makes the bar in the receiver grind, and gives grinding tension to the tremolo. You can seriously feel this in the whammy bar. So you must make tiny, minute adjustments to each trem claw screw to both a) adjust the height of the bridge like normal and now b) keep the claw and trem block perfectly aligned, | = | .
So where once the two screws' unequal tension or length didn't matter, now it matters! I find the best way to get it aligned is ignore the Tremol-no initially. Focus on the height of the trem. Get it about where you want it (though maybe a bit higher, see section below for the reason) and THEN adjust only ONE claw screw while pulling up and down on the whammy bar, feeling carefully for tension. When the one screw you are adjusting comes aligned with the other, you'll feel a significant decrease in the tension on the whammy/bridge. That's the sweet spot. Leave it. To do this, I literally have one hand, my right, behind the guitar with a screwdriver adjusting the one claw screw and my left hand pulling the whammy bar in and out.
ONE PROBLEM
The Tremol-no has one issue that I haven't been able to resolve or avoid. Other Tremol-no owners can let me know if they find this issue as well.
This is also a bit hard to explain, so bear with me please.
If you look in the previously posted pictures, you can see there are two small allen screws on the top of the Tremol-no claw. These tighten down on the trem wood screws to secure it. Seeing as the original claw has no such locking mechanism, I assume this is to prevent any movement of the claw across the screws, but I don't fully understand why it is necessary. In my opinion, wouldn't the tension in the springs keep the claw flush at the end of the screws?
Regardless, these screws, when loose, hold the claw in a slightly different angle then when they are tightened. So when tightened, the Tremol-no pulls slightly on the trem springs. The tightening of the locking screws push on the claw.
The effect of this is troublesome during a set up. Because you need to have these locking screws loosened to adjust the trem claw screws, you then need to lock them to see the actual tremolo height in the cavity. And when you lock them, you increase the tension, and the bridge dips.
So what you have here is the inability to visually set the proper height of the trem (angle in the cavity I mean, to keep it level). Because if the strings are in tune but the bridge is a bit high, you will tighten the claw screws so the bridge sits a bit lower. Then, you retune the strings because they have gone sharp due to the increased tension in the springs. Assuming they get in tune just as the bridge goes level, normally you are fine. The bridge is set up just fine. But with the Tremol-no, you then need to lock these tiny screws on the trem claw screws, and by doing so it pulls more on the springs. So your bridge dips more, and the strings go sharp, and when you retune the bridge is sitting too low.
You can see the problem here; it's a kind of Catch 22. The Tremol-no can't be used without the locking screws set. But you can't adjust the claw screws without unlocking the locking screws. Because the tension between locked and unlocked is different, the guitar can't be adjusted in the state it will eventually take...
Sorry it's difficult to explain. But this requires the kind of "guess work" as to the effect of the locking screws on the tension of the bridge. I find myself setting the trem a bit higher when working on the trem claw screws, then locking the locking screws on the trem screws and I find it pulls it enough to have the trem around perfect level.
"DEEP-C" PROBLEM
The Tremol-no has two locking abilities, one to fully lock the trem, which works great with two thumb screws, and another to put the bridge in "dive-only" mode with one thumb screw.
I have not, in nearly 2 months of use, been able to get the guitar to stay in tune in "dive-only" mode. The trem goes down, comes back, and the guitar is out of tune.
Therefore I don't use "dive-only" mode and consider it useless.
I don't know what the problem is, although I can only imagine it is either the single thumb screw lacking enough clamping power to stay still OR it is the design of the unit, which necessitates full locking (with two thumb screws) before locking the "Deep-C" screw and then unlocking the two original screws to leave the "Deep-C" by itself. I think the two are not able to function apart.
Again, this is hard to describe, but suffice to say the guitar won't stay in tune with in "dive-only" mode.
TUNING ISSUES
Aside from the "dive-only" tuning problems, I find that when properly set up, the guitar can switch from locked trem mode to full-flating mode without a need for a retune. Still, I find myself checking the tuning lot more often and sometimes wishing I didn't have to. Occasionally the guitar isn't as stable as it used to be.
SPECIFICS to the JP
I find the JP can fit the Tremol-no with the small spacer provided. The thumb screws and receiver clamp (on the bottom of the trem block) stick out just slightly from the back of the guitar (see previously posted pictures, although those were taken with the larger spacer). Cutting holes in the trem plate is necessary not only for access to the screws (the reason you bought the Tremol-no in the first place, so you need access) but also because the cover will no longer fit on. Thankfully, the JP trem cover is of substantial thickness and I PREDICT even with holes in it it will protect the trem parts from my shirt, belt, or buttons while playing. Without a trem plate I find that I can sometimes catch my clothes on the Tremol-no.
I'm currently hacking my original trem-plate to bits, so I'll hopefully fill you all in on that later.
CONCLUSIONS
The Tremol-no is a great device which has added a ton of versatility to my guitar.
I use the locking mechanism not only for alternate tunings, but also for blues (to prevent flat notes while bending and hitting another note) and also acoustic riffing (I find a steady bridge sounds better).
The Tremol-no is NOT for newbies. If you can't set up your own guitar fully, don't think you can manage a Tremol-no. You need to know virtually all the working parts of your guitar to troubleshoot what eventually may become a headache.
Also, the Tremol-no will alter the feel of your guitar, for better or for worse. I'll put this another way... if you like the guitar you have now as it is and don't want to change it, don't. The Tremol-no changed my JP for better in some ways and worse in some others. The trem is the same but different in some ways.
So, really, it's a tradeoff: Trade a bit of feel in the trem and some frustration during setup for a lot of new tuning options and potentially some convenience at some points.
I hope this little review helps some of the Tremol-no hopefuls out there!
the24thfret
Well-known member
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I will add that they have released two new versions:
Tremol-No™
I have the first version, the "pin-type"...
I am assuming, by looking at the pictures, that the new "clamp-type" clamps to the trem block but will not resolve any of the issues I mentioned above.
Tremol-No™
I have the first version, the "pin-type"...
I am assuming, by looking at the pictures, that the new "clamp-type" clamps to the trem block but will not resolve any of the issues I mentioned above.
marantz1300
Well-known member
trem a no
where can you get one in england ? how much do they cost?
where can you get one in england ? how much do they cost?
Yo 24th... THANKS for the excellent review and insight into this. I'm still considering one for my JP. I bought a Floyd Rose Trem Block thing for $10 on sale and installed it. It works perfectly and all, however, when diving down and returning to neutral, it bugs me that you can "feel" it come to a stop. I padded mine a bit so that it was metal on metal, but still, it's kinda strange. I had a hard time finding a set up that allowed my bridge to stay neutral, and my trem to stay slinky, so I took it off for now.
I found an article on the Floyd Rose site on how to best tune a floating trem, and that has helped me a TON. How to compensate your strings as you go from string to string, so that when you get to the high E, you're VERY close to being in tune. Rather than it be a constant battle. So that helped. If you want the article I can send it. It's probably common knowledge, but I'm a noob to floating trems.
You know, the Luke is supposed to be floating right? But the trem on my Luke vs the JP is quite different. The Luke's trem seems to rest against the body, so de-tuning doesn't really throw it that far out of tune like the JP.
Anyway, great review! Gives a lot of food for thought!
Jason
I found an article on the Floyd Rose site on how to best tune a floating trem, and that has helped me a TON. How to compensate your strings as you go from string to string, so that when you get to the high E, you're VERY close to being in tune. Rather than it be a constant battle. So that helped. If you want the article I can send it. It's probably common knowledge, but I'm a noob to floating trems.
You know, the Luke is supposed to be floating right? But the trem on my Luke vs the JP is quite different. The Luke's trem seems to rest against the body, so de-tuning doesn't really throw it that far out of tune like the JP.
Anyway, great review! Gives a lot of food for thought!
Jason
the24thfret
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No problem, Jason! Why not drop that link in here for any other surfers to check out. I don't know much about the Luke bridge, but I know it can be either full floating or "classic" trem. Nice Luke by the way!
marantz1300
Well-known member
Devnor
Well-known member
It really is for newbies. While it advertises floating, EVH and hardtail modes it does this at the expense of added complexity, weight and loss of trem sensitivity. One of the strengths of the JP model is simplicity when it comes to tuning. But introducing the tremolno to mix just adds more adjustments and issues.
I really cannot envision a live or studio situation where I would be fiddling with that thing switching floating & fixed modes while people are waiting...especially an audience.
the24thfret
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Don't you mean it ISN'T for newbies? It looks like you agree with me.
