GC Pricing...your opinion!!!!!!!!!!

[Jack FFR1846]

Marty,

The Natick, MA store does not haggle. I've only bought 2 guitars from them so far (a used Godin and a new Martin LXM for my son + 2 amps). The MOST valuable thing that GC has is the 30 day trial period. I know that I can just buy the guitar and really figure out at home if I want to own it. If not, I bring it in.

I tried to haggle on both guitars but was told that there was no negotiation. I have no issue with that. The fact that the guitar was IN the store was the selling feature for me. I could have paid another $40 for a new Godin, but I've found that the quality is unlike EBMM's......they're much more hit or miss.

I'll also add that the guitar manager there (Mike) keeps me coming back. I get good advice on everything from if a craigslist guitar is a good deal to how to do pinch harmonics. I bring in the kids and they love Mike as well.

No haggle is low stress. If I feel that there's going to be stress, I'll go someplace else. I'll haggle with the people selling on Craigslist.

Feel free to contact me to talk about Guitar Center or other places to purchase. I am literally....always looking for guitars to buy.

Oh.....if you can ask Natick to discount that Axis just for me, I'll bring it home.....they'll know who is asking since I have more miles on it than I do on my own car.....

***after reading some other responses...I want to add something. Having a set, no haggle price makes everyone's expectations equal. With the web, anyone can see if the price isn't right....then the match price comes into play. What I have received at GC are the little things that really work well for me. I bought a used sub1 off craigslist. There was no trem bar. Mike looked around and found one in the spares drawer that was obviously very used.....but it fit and worked fine. Freebie. Made me very happy and cost GC nothing. I've recieved some trem springs the same way......odd stuff that's banging around. Again, cost GC nothing and made me very happy. My give back on this is that I needed some headphones. Circuit City, Bestbuy, Target, heck...even Wal*Mart are closer and cheaper. I went out of my way to buy them at GC. People who treat me well get return business.


jack

 

[kbaim]

It's been 2-3 months since I've been in a GC...has this already been adopted?? Based on fred's comments, it seems it may already have. Maybe I'll stop in next week.

I think a fair percentage of shoppers (especially moms?) may not even know haggling can save them extra money especially on the big ticket items.

Personally, I feel GC has pretty fair pricing before the haggling, and with all the gear I've bought from them in the last 5-6 years, it's worth it to me to try and get a better price by negotiating a little. Although the last few purchases there I've just trusted that the price the Manager at the store was giving me was even better than I could have done for myself so I'm loyal to him and GC (and Pete Dubaldo).

My suggestion would be to test market the idea in several stores in areas not saturated by other GC's so as not to cannibalize sales and see how customers respond.

Typically I prefer getting better deals now than at some point in the future all things being equal.

 

[brett8388]

I'll give you an example of some of my $ that didn't go GC's way today over a no-haggle policy. I called a CO GC for a used piece for a fellow collector friend because he knows I have a good buyers history with GC. I spoke to the manager about the guitar and it sounded like just what he wanted. I asked for a little break on the price as a loyal customer - I wasn't asking for much - little over 10% would have made me happy. I was told "no, that's the price - same for you as it is anyone." I passed.

It puts me off when a store I've spent that kind of cash with tells me basically I'm as valued as some kid buying a $5 pack of strings. Not to sound stuck up or elitist, but I'm more valuable than a kid buying a $5 pack of strings! Any mom and pop store would realize this, understand that I don't waste time or "tire-kick," and would work to make a deal with me.

If you're going to go No Negotiating, then give some kind of loyalty break to customers like me or I'll take my next $40K in guitar purchases to ebay, craigs list, or any of the multiple gear outlets the internet brings to my fingers.

 

[Sweat]

I hope the no negotiating has not gone into effect because I know the prices on some items (EBMM Guitars) are above what I can get the same thing for less elsewhere, plus as mentioned in other posts, if it is the price on the tag, they need to be pulling an unopened box from stock, not the one that every teen wanker has abused.

I like GC and like some off the people I know that work there, nice and helpful sales people, they know when to ask me if I need help and know when to leve me alone.

I also wish they had an employee whose only job was to maintain the floor stock, saw a Schecter today that was so dusty that I would not even touch it. Plus broken strings is a big turnoff.

And as Bret said here is an example of $$ going elsewhere, I posted this example in the orignal thread but needs to be retold since I was in this GC again today and nothing has changed in a weeks time.

They have a Candy Red Silo that I was very interested in, had cash in hand all they needed to do was say this is your out the door price and if it was reasonable I would have brought it home, BUT

First it was priced wrong had a tag on it, right item description, that was the cost of a BFR, I asked what was up with that, said it was an invoicing issue and they would get back to me, well a week later no response and the guitar is still there still priced wrong, would have loved to buy it but went elsewhere with the $$, again point being negotiation is needed on items at GC.

 

[Spudmurphy]

I fully understand the need to barter in a culture like the Middle East - it is all part of the buying ethic. I'm kind of sad that it has taken a grip on our Culture.
The problem is that many years ago (I'm talking back in the early 70's) the only price comparison you could make was comparing the advertised prices in magazines like Melody Maker or if you spent a lot of money making phone calls around the country. (yes calls were very expensive then)Now with technology as it is you can do a price comparison around the country (or for that matter World - in a matter of minutes) and try to use the argument that "I have seen it cheaper in XYZ on the interweb) so do it for that price!!"

When I bought gear a lot (not so now) I was glad if they threw in a free set of strings or alerted me to a nice guitar that they just had in - I wasn't out to bleed them dry - I merely built up a rapport with the shop which paid dividends in other ways.

To sign off I would say that if I paid for something in cash and a peer bought something with a credit card - should I get it for less? - the shop wouldn't incur a charge by the credit card company after all.

Maybe then a small discount for cash ?

 

[Pittman75]

I think negotiation on new gear is only okay if its a NOS. Something that You KNOW has been in the store for over like a year or so. Or, a discontinued item, a floor model, or something like that. Other than that, you really can't negotiate much. They do have the lowest prices anywhere- but on anything expensive like guitars you generally wouldn't just pay the sticker price. You wouldn't walk into a car dealership and say- that price is good enough- I'll take it!

Used gear negotiation is a must. GC prices are notoriously extremely high. I frequently see Used JP's with no options priced higher than JP's at say, Dubaldo's with the same or even more upgraded options. I say keep it in, its part of the game.

Plus, it keeps your salesmen on their toes. And we all know what happens when GC salespeople don't. Its good for the business, because they have to KNOW their gear, at least I think. My store doesn't do negotiations though- so this is really me venting my frustrations. I tell you it isn't fun to see a customer walk out the door because when they ask, "Is this the best you can do?" you are forced to say yes.

 

[Pittman75]

A few additional thoughts:

1) lowest price guarantee means nothing to me. I'll make sure the price is right before I leave the house.

2) 30-day no questions return is nice, but I can't think of a single piece of gear that I've ever returned to a retail music store in 26 years of playing. I'd expect the store to take back something that was damaged or broken upon opening it. And it would be nice if they took care of something that broke within the first few weeks without me having to go through the manufacturer. Other than that, I don't really expect the store to let me habitually borrow gear. I guess my point is that the return policy isn't what gets me into the store. I couldn't tell you what the return policy is at my local Mom-and-Pop where I buy almost all of my gear. I know they'd take care of me if the situation was reasonable though. That's all that matters to me in the end.

Yeah, but its nice security to know that you still can return it. It isn't very nice however, when the salespeople at stores get mad at you for returning. Simply put: Don't have a return policy if it pisses off the employees.

 

[mark_tampa]

I don't like to haggle on prices myself, however in this age of internet, I never purchase anything without knowing what I can get it for online.

I don't mind paying $75-100 more on a $1000 item if it's a item that is IN STOCK at my local Guitar Center (there are three of them within a 45 minute drive). If the sticker is more than what I'm willing to pay, I don't barter, I just walk out of the store and purchase the item somewhere else. I really don't care about a price guarantee or matching, if the sticker price is too high, I'm gone out the door.

If the price is fair, I don't have any problem dealing with my local Guitar Centers - but all my EBMM guitar purchases come from a local vendor for two reasons, I've only seen ONE new EBMM guitar at any of the three Tampa area GC's (and it was way over priced) and my local EBMM dealer sold me my guitars at a better price than I've seen anywhere else.

A well informed customer will already have an idea of what a item sells for, if GC keeps it's prices fair, then no haggle prices are fine by me...

 

[TNT]

From much experience:

I've bought gear from GC for decades, including the SF store and all the others in the Bay Area and Northern Calif! It's NOT about money when it comes to buying music gear it's about PURCHASE PRICE!

The "normal" musician buyer emphasizes to other musicians about the price he got more than what he got!!

So then, what is the "psychology of the sale? The buyer MUST BELIEVE HE GOT A DEAL so he feels good about the purchase!! And, that more often than not must be below asking price.

And, you can't compare Best Buy or Walmart to GC. You never could go into Wal-Mart and negotiate 3 pair of pants (otherwise you would). However, you CAN at a music store or car dealership.

So, I say here to Marty, unless you are positively, absolutely certain that the asking price you have on the tag is "UNBEATABLE" anywhere in the world (on-line), then don't impliment the change. Why lose a sale before you can try??

Remember, the ONLY thing you have over the "on-line" stores is the customer can "touch" the product - use that to your advantage, since you pay the lease for this buyer amenity! Don't let him then "leave" and buy on-line for less price.

Guaranteed Low Prices sayings have no impact. You are much better off saying you will not only MATCH, BUT BEAT any price, anywhere (by even a penny, remember, make the buyer feel as though he got the best deal anywhere).

Now, you have the market cornered - why? 1. Buyer can actually touch the product 2. Buyer can take it home today 3. Buyer got the best price anywhere in the world. The buyer has absolutely NO reason not to buy it today from GC.

So, in summing up, GC then now has all the 90% bottom feeder buyers, as well as all the rest of those above and beyond the tag price.

Oh, here is another bit of advice. If a buyer comes in and says, " he has such n' such a price on an item, and is GC able to beat it? Don't make the guy jump thru hoops to prove it, e.g., go get an notoraized "affidavit", photo of the store, and the salesmans mother's maiden name, etc. . . ., just beat the dang price, swipe his card and go on to the next sale!

If you don't - someone else will!!

 

[TNT]

From much experience:

I've bought gear from GC for decades, including the SF store and all the others in the Bay Area and Northern Calif! It's NOT about money when it comes to buying music gear it's about PURCHASE PRICE!

The "normal" musician buyer emphasizes to other musicians about the price he got more than what he got!!

So then, what is the "psychology of the sale? The buyer MUST BELIEVE HE GOT A DEAL so he feels good about the purchase!! And, that more often than not must be below asking price.

And, you can't compare Best Buy or Walmart to GC. You never could go into Wal-Mart and negotiate 3 pair of pants (otherwise you would). However, you CAN at a music store or car dealership.

So, I say here to Marty, unless you are positively, absolutely certain that the asking price you have on the tag is "UNBEATABLE" anywhere in the world (on-line), then don't impliment the change. Why lose a sale before you can try??

Remember, the ONLY thing you have over the "on-line" stores is the customer can "touch" the product - use that to your advantage, since you pay the lease for this buyer amenity! Don't let him then "leave" and buy on-line for less price.

Guaranteed Low Prices sayings have no impact. You are much better off saying you will not only MATCH, BUT BEAT any price, anywhere (by even a penny, remember, make the buyer feel as though he got the best deal anywhere).

Now, you have the market cornered - why? 1. Buyer can actually touch the product 2. Buyer can take it home today 3. Buyer got the best price anywhere in the world. The buyer has absolutely NO reason not to buy it today from GC.

So, in summing up, GC then now has all the 90% bottom feeder buyers, as well as all the rest of those above and beyond the tag price.

Oh, here is another bit of advice. If a buyer comes in and says, " he has such n' such a price on an item, and is GC able to beat it? Don't make the guy jump thru hoops to prove it, e.g., go get an notoraized "affidavit", photo of the store, and the salesmans mother's maiden name, etc. . . ., just beat the dang price, swipe his card and go on to the next sale!

If you don't - someone else will!!

 

[INMT]

I like the "no dicker sticker" idea. Haggling is for open air markets
I'm always willing to pay for service and go where the serviceis.
Hell I have a MM dealer just a few miles away and I buy my instruments from "that guy" in Connecticut.
No Guitar Centers in Montana ( it could never support one) But I frequented the Lawndale,Ca. (the orig and when it "moved" across the street from the Galleria).
Since not many sales persons are the same from month to month "getting to know" a particular one for "deals" does not really happen (maybe in other markets) so it's worthless in my opinion go the haggle route any longer.
Thanks for the opportunity to share my opinions.

INMT

 

[Pittman75]

Marty,

The Natick, MA store does not haggle. I've only bought 2 guitars from them so far (a used Godin and a new Martin LXM for my son + 2 amps). The MOST valuable thing that GC has is the 30 day trial period. I know that I can just buy the guitar and really figure out at home if I want to own it. If not, I bring it in.

I tried to haggle on both guitars but was told that there was no negotiation. I have no issue with that. The fact that the guitar was IN the store was the selling feature for me. I could have paid another $40 for a new Godin, but I've found that the quality is unlike EBMM's......they're much more hit or miss.

I'll also add that the guitar manager there (Mike) keeps me coming back. I get good advice on everything from if a craigslist guitar is a good deal to how to do pinch harmonics. I bring in the kids and they love Mike as well.

No haggle is low stress. If I feel that there's going to be stress, I'll go someplace else. I'll haggle with the people selling on Craigslist.

Feel free to contact me to talk about Guitar Center or other places to purchase. I am literally....always looking for guitars to buy.

Oh.....if you can ask Natick to discount that Axis just for me, I'll bring it home.....they'll know who is asking since I have more miles on it than I do on my own car.....

***after reading some other responses...I want to add something. Having a set, no haggle price makes everyone's expectations equal. With the web, anyone can see if the price isn't right....then the match price comes into play. What I have received at GC are the little things that really work well for me. I bought a used sub1 off craigslist. There was no trem bar. Mike looked around and found one in the spares drawer that was obviously very used.....but it fit and worked fine. Freebie. Made me very happy and cost GC nothing. I've recieved some trem springs the same way......odd stuff that's banging around. Again, cost GC nothing and made me very happy. My give back on this is that I needed some headphones. Circuit City, Bestbuy, Target, heck...even Wal*Mart are closer and cheaper. I went out of my way to buy them at GC. People who treat me well get return business.


jack

+1. Jack, I have to agree with you. Mike is nothing but help. What a nice guy. Marty, if you read this- please please call the natick store. Tell mike what a great job he's doing. Do the same for keith as well. Love that guy.

 

[MatrixAndyR]

In the Atlanta store down here its already in place. It really seems like some of the salesmen hate it though. I've spent a good 20-30k in there and I've got a few people I normally buy from who get me 10% off usually. I'm not one to go in there and talk for even 30 mins about "Well what about... an extra 20 off... and maybe 25?" I've spent enough cash there and come back on a frequent bassis they just chop it off for me. When I went in to buy a 7 string BFR I had one of the salesmen even tell me "come back in a few months, hopefully I can help you out then. Right now though, you'd have to pay full, and I'd hate to do that to you." I was quiet surprised that the guy making money off me felt bad enough to tell me to not buy it.

It really all comes down to what exactly is the replacement... reward points? I already have a "reward card" from bassically every store in existance, and its annoying to have to shift through all of them to find any particular one. I'd rather have the ablity to knock off a few percent points for a "loyal" customer.

As someone already pointed out. I'd not care so much if when you paid the full price... you got the "full" deal, but you're really getting a somewhat used instrument. I went to GC a few days ago and saw a Satch JS1200 with a decent sized scratch in it. The best offer he was "allowed" to give was tag price out the door. Not exactly a great deal, but I mean I guess it is SOMETHING.

I've also seen one fellow buyer get pretty pissed off when he found out about this. He was gonna buy about 4k worth of instruments (2 Gibsons) and when he was talking to his sales person they said they couldn't lower it any for him. He couldn't believe it, came up to a few other buyers and asked "anyone you know here giving you anything off?" We all said no, and he left. It's just sad to see relationships with salesmen seem to decrease because of this issue.

 

[petruccirocks02]

Here are my thoughts:

1. I've spent $17,000 and some odd dollars in the past 5 years at my local GC and really wouldn't shop anywhere else. I like the idea of a loyalty type program, but I think sticking with the price negotiation thing is good. I wouldn't have most of my gear if GC hadn't helped me out on the price, being that I'm unemployed and all. I find it somewhat comforting that I can go into my local GC, and since I've been shopping there since the day they opened, that they're willing to help me out on the price without me even having to haggle. I would definitely say that getting rid of the price negotiation thing is a bad idea, but at the same time I think a loyalty program is cool, but I'd rather have the price negotiation.

The price thing it seems is already in effect in my local store as well, as someone mentioned above about their local GC, and I don't think that most of the employees are digging it. I know the guys at my local GC definitely don't mind hooking me up, and since then when I've gone in to buy gear, they seem kinda sad that they can't help me out on the price. Just another thought.

-Phil

 

[chrisallen]

well, what if that "non-negotiating" price WAS that hook up price. guaranteed...?

i think there's a stigma with music stores where you HAVE to negotiate or else you didn't get a deal... even if the store is honestly giving you "the best price."

i mean, everyone here knows that any retail store sells a product for more than what it cost them to buy it, right? how much more? 20% 30%? More? 70%??? who knows!

i heard markup on alcohol on most bars is over 100% do you try to negotiate with them? how about getting milk at the grocery store... do you ask them to give you a discount if you buy 2 bottles? free pack of gum with purchase of fruit basket?

doesn't that sound ridiculous anywhere other than a music store?

but the store definitely has to make a profit to keep their doors open. negotiating sometimes makes a dealer cut into that profit, and i've definitely seen stores go out of business quickly because of that.

i hate the negotiation process. i always leave thinking "what if i said something different, would i have gotten a better deal?"

 

[ZippoTragedy]

GC Eval: Pro/Con + Summary

This is a good post with sensible information.
Relationships drive sales, period - The End.

Loyalty Programs are for the birds.
Most people are saavy enough to understand the wholesale/retail game, and the Internet guarantees price competition.

The key benefit of going to GC is:
playing the instrument
being able to take your purchase immediately
exchange poilcy is unbelievably positive - a key factor in my buying from GC when I took on a new instrument.

That being said, the key drawback for GC is:

not price competitive
poor selection
most goods in the store have been played and or returned, extensively
frequently fail to include necessary items like case-candy, manuals, etc.
most gear is profiled against new to mid-level players
hardly any stores carry custom instruments or equipment - and that's the stuff people with money want to buy (EB is a prime example)
Return policy can sometimes work against people - get gear that's been messed with or lacks a complete inventory (docs, batteries, cables, etc.)

we have one store in this area who fought tooth and nail to carry high-end amps/cabs - diezel, uber, M/B, Soldano; and yet they carry ass for guitars.

in this state, sales tax approaches 9%. that makes the prospect of buying a $2-3,000 instrument very painful. most online stores (with some notable exceptions) have no tax and ship for free with generous RMA policies.

seems to me that's what you're competing with.

in summary:

drop the crap inventory as the bulk of your items
stock mad gear - the kind you'd want to play (and buy)
cash/carry is a huge plus: embrace it
no one will kick you in the balls on price if they feel like they're getting value for their time + service + professional expertise (opinions that count) but, you should be prepared to put inventory at a *reasonable* margin and not fleece people just because you can. if the price differential is $50-100 on a $2,500 guitar, I'll gladly pay that for the ability to walk out of the store with exactly what I want, right then and right there.

I've probably bought $40K worth of guitars at GC over the years and am good friends with a few GC managers.

I lthink the relationships I've been able to build as a loyal customer with serious buying power helps GC managers. If you take away their ability to haggle on the price, other music stores will have an edge on GC. I can see maybe a no-negotiating policy on new gear, but on especially used gear, you have to leave the manager with some room to allow them to move products, especially to loyal customers. I think a two tiered policy addressing new and used gear would work best.

While I have the CEO's attention, I'd like to ask if you have a program in place to maintain safety and compliance in your stores for both visitors and employees? I visit GC's regularly in FL, TX, TN, and CA and I'm always amazed by the unsafe acts and unsafe conditions I see in the stores, and as a CSP, I have a duty to mention these issues when I'm in the stores to management. I'm normally met with blank faces when I talk about potential problems.

You have internal (your employees) and external (your customers) exposures and in my opinion your program to control loss could use some help.

Brett Coleman, CSP

 

[spychocyco]

From much experience:

I've bought gear from GC for decades, including the SF store and all the others in the Bay Area and Northern Calif! It's NOT about money when it comes to buying music gear it's about PURCHASE PRICE!

The "normal" musician buyer emphasizes to other musicians about the price he got more than what he got!!

I'm going to disagree with that a little. Yeah, everyone likes to feel like they got a deal and likes to brag about getting a deal. On the other hand, I think service plays a big part, too. I'm willing to pay slightly more on anything at a place where I can get better service. Granted, I'm not going to pay a lot more, but if there's $50 difference between the guitar I want at a place where they treat me like crap and a place where I'm treated like a valued customer, I'm going with the second place every time.

I don't have that problem because GC beats my local stores hands down on price, even with the two-hour drive thrown in. My experience with GC has, to this point, been nothing but positive. I've never had a salesman be rude to me, I've never had a salesman try to hard sell me something I didn't want, I've never been ignored there. Every time I've gone into the GC, I've felt like I was valued and they wanted to help me in any way they could. Sure, that's their job, and that's how it should be. But it definitely ain't like that everywhere. That goes farther with me than bottom line price, and I'm willing to spend a little more money to shop in a place like that.

I gotta say, I like the idea of give me your best price, and I'll decide if I want to pay it. I've got enough stress in my life already without having to dicker with a salesman over a guitar. If I know I'm going to have to spend half an hour trying to wear somebody down, I'd rather just play the ones I've got.

 

[NorM]

Never did haggle
I told them what I wanted to pay for the special order and it was accepted.
I wanted a specific EBMM instrument and they had it. The price they quoted me made me buy it on the spot. The employees and the managers and the customers that have been there all this time work well together. If you guys are happy then I'm happy too.

There have been some guitar deals I have made in the past that I truly regret not ordering through GC. You guys (and gals) could have made it so much easier.
DuBaldo has been cool

 

[Jack FFR1846]

+1. Jack, I have to agree with you. Mike is nothing but help. What a nice guy. Marty, if you read this- please please call the natick store. Tell mike what a great job he's doing. Do the same for keith as well. Love that guy.

+1 on Keith too. No pressure, just help. Low key guy. I bought my used Godin from him on a Sunday (Mike's day off) and the commission was split (I know because the sales receipt has both names on there).


On the loyalty note.....if I go to GC and am going specifically to buy something right there and then, if I don't see Mike's car in the lot or Keith inside, I'll play the JP for half an hour, ask if Mike's there and if not leave and come back when he is there. Other sales guys there have noticed that I do this (I've heard comments). They just haven't figured out why.

On another note......I would absolutely LOVE to be able to see specific store stock online. I went up to the Nashua GC to check it out for the first time. Not a single EB. Tons of Fenders and Gibsons (no interest to me). I settled down with a Laguna/trem (your store brand....great value, by the way).

jack

 

[Astrofreq]

I got my Green EVH new for $1325 shipped. How's that for a deal at GC?

Seriously though, I've been shopping at GC for probably 18 years. I'd have to say that GC employees have been consistently kind and helpful. Generally, I'll find what I want online at the best price, print out the screen shot and take it to GC, just so I can get the same price and walk home with it. If it's a higher priced item, I have a formula in my head that gets me to the absolute lowest price, then I work from there.

Didn't Mars Music try the haggle-free attempt and fail? Granted, I don't remember what they're prices were compared to GC. Maybe they were asking more than the deals at GC.