Off Topic Humbucking to single coil sounds?

[acwild]

I just watched a video of a guy claiming that taking out half the pole pieces from a humbucker is a way to get your humbucking guitars to "sound like a Tele." While I'm skeptical, I figured that it's an easy enough thing to try. I wouldn't recommend trying this unless you have pole pieces that you can screw out.
My guitar definitely doesn't sound like a Tele but it did change the sound. I promptly put the pole pieces back in as it wasn't an effect that I desired. Jmho but it might be an interesting experiment for those of you who are bored.

 

[beej]

Ugh ... that guy. That doesn't work so well for most pickups.

Unfortunately there's really no great way to get a humbucker to sound like a single. You can split the coils, but unless one coil is particularly hot, it'll sound anaemic. You can run them in parallel, but same deal- can sound good, but not really like a single. I've also used a Bill Lawrence "Q-Filter" (wired as a variable inductor) to reduce the inductance of a hot pickup and make it sound more like a single, but again it's not exactly there.

At least with those mods, you can switch back and forth quickly when you need it. With the polepieces ... not so much.

 

[ScoobySteve]

I think the tele and the strat "single coil tones" have more to do with how the instruments were engineered than the pups themselves.

If ya want single coil tones, get a single coil guitar, or an HSS/GC! Just my 02

 

[acwild]

Ugh ... that guy. That doesn't work so well for most pickups.

Unfortunately there's really no great way to get a humbucker to sound like a single. You can split the coils, but unless one coil is particularly hot, it'll sound anaemic. You can run them in parallel, but same deal- can sound good, but not really like a single. I've also used a Bill Lawrence "Q-Filter" (wired as a variable inductor) to reduce the inductance of a hot pickup and make it sound more like a single, but again it's not exactly there.

At least with those mods, you can switch back and forth quickly when you need it. With the polepieces ... not so much.

Ha ha, I was thinking the same about "that guy" which is why I didn't bother posting the video. I tried it out of curiosity since it's something that can be done easily and quickly. The results were lackluster for me but now it's something else that I know about my guitar. Personally, I hate the split-coil sound. Most humbuckers were definitely not designed with splitting sounds in mind. There is a way to partially tap into the other coil so that a split isn't one or the other but one and a bit of the other. That method seems to work properly. I believe that's what PRS does with the DGT.

I think the tele and the strat "single coil tones" have more to do with how the instruments were engineered than the pups themselves.

If ya want single coil tones, get a single coil guitar, or an HSS/GC! Just my 02

I agree 100%.

 

[auxren]

I put a push-pull pot on my Axis to split the coils and love the sound! Its obviously not as stratty sounding as my strat, but it cleans up a bit and offers some useful sounds.

 

[Spudmurphy]

Interesting thread.
Now bearing in mind my very limited experience of guitar electrics, here's my 2'd worth!!

A good friend of mine makes pickups (Shed Pickups UK). He explained to me some time ago that when you split a Humbucker, the magnetic field will not be like that of a true single coil, because the magnet in the inactive coil of the bucker will still be exerting it's forces within the overall magnetic field.

OK I can follow that. Now when you posted this and told me that a guy had taken the pole pieces out, then that would in essence resolve the magnetic field factor,, but hey, now you have a single coil whose windings are not like a conventional SS. I'll shadup now, cos I'm out of my depth. I'm sure that a certain "Physics" oriented Mod would be able to throw more than 2d into the pot!!

 

[acwild]

Keep in mind that I'm just passing on what "that guy" said. I don't agree with him but thought that it's an easy enough experiment to try and it could yield interesting results. For me, the results weren't positive through my setup.
Generally speaking though, I do know that most humbuckers were designed to have a certain voicing as a whole unit with no regard to how it would sound split, thus the weak and thin results. That doesn't mean that it can't sound good.

 

[DrKev]

I'm sure that a certain "Physics" oriented Mod would be able to throw more than 2d into the pot!!

Erm, not really, no. I can bias an amp and install pickups but my knowledge of electronics stops there. I was better with lasers, you see. I wonder if anyone has attempted a rigorous electromagnetic theory of pickups? It may be a magnet and some wire but the minute you try to model it with Maxwell's equations, well, let's just say we'll be changing our pants in a hurry.

But I'd love to have a week picking Bill Lawrence's brain.

Having said that, no matter what theories or techniques anyone has about building pickups, the varieties and choices on the market are endless and what one person will consider the holy grail of single coil tone, another will despise.

We're a damn picky lot, us guitarists. We should spend less time chasing tone and more time choosing notes!

Now, I want to re-wire the selector switch on my Silo Special? Who'll loan me an PDN HSH Game Changer so I can try some stuff out, without removing any pole screws?

 

[uOpt]

This is just nonsense.

The major difference between a Fender-style single coil pickup on one hand and Gibson style P90s and humbuckers on the other hand is that the latter have a bar magnet (or several) on the bottom and the polepieces are passively magnetic. Fender uses rod magnets (including in it's wide-range humbuckers).

That causes a massive sound change regardless of wind and whether you split your total windings into two coils or not. The passive polepieces smoothen out the sound a lot. That's why a 7Kohm P90 doesn't sound like a 7Kohm Tele pickup.

Removing one bobbin and coil from a humbucker won't move it close to a P90 because now you lack half the windings.

 

[DrKev]

That's why a 7Kohm P90 doesn't sound like a 7Kohm Tele pickup.

You're not wrong, but even that is way too simple an explanation. Remember, number of windings, DC resistance, and inductance also depend on the wire gauge. And I've heard plenty of single coils with bar magnets on the bottom.

 

[vintagebluesguy]

Recently I use an Equalizer module in Zoom G3 to get a single coil tone from my Axis and Silhouette. I lower the bass, low-mid and set the treble a bit higher and I'm really happy with the result. Single coil tone with no volume loss and no hiss.

 

[uOpt]

You're not wrong, but even that is way too simple an explanation. Remember, number of windings, DC resistance, and inductance also depend on the wire gauge. And I've heard plenty of single coils with bar magnets on the bottom.

Well a P90 and a Tele pickup as such as both awg42 (unless they are "hot" variants) and have very comparable winds, inductance and capacitance - and sound completely different.

Your point about existing Fender-style pickups that have a magnet (usually ceramic) on the bottom is valid, however these are almost all very cheap Asian pickups that don't compete in the sound department.